« first day (1232 days earlier)      last day (3706 days later) » 

6:00 AM
mmm, Laura Prepon and Mila Kunis, you've reminded me why I liked that serie that much
 
@Borgleader @ScarletAmaranth I was unable to connect at first due to local Google domain. Tip: you could do google.com/ncr to remove country-specific settings like local top-level domain.
 
and how do I tell them never to ever infer my location xD?
I don't want anything in Slovak
hell I will soon forget the language entirely
 
damnit i waited too long before going to bed and now im hungry =/
 
Google insists on speaking Tagalog to me, except for Maps, which starts with the Continental USA no matter where I go.
 
@Potatoswatter Did /ncr help?
Oh, that unintended pun.
 
6:07 AM
I'm really exaggerating the problem anyway. Maps does seem to be inconsistent though.
 
@ScottW Yes even cyborgs get hungry from time to time
 
Cue Jeri Ryan…
 
@Potatoswatter maps.google.it will start elsewhere..
 
I wish C++ had better tools :(
 
@Rapptz I hear that as "I wish clang can work on windows."
 
6:13 AM
@kwak google.com redirects to your locale, but maps.google.com doesn't, that's all. If you start at google.com, get redirected, and then click maps, you end up in the right place, but it seems like a lot of work. And if you travel a lot, you'll have to bookmark google.com/ncr but there's no bookmark (AFAIK) that will do the right thing for maps.
 
@MarkGarcia not really
 
@Rapptz such as?
 
What particular tool are you wanting now?
 
@Rapptz Or maybe "I wish I was invited in the Jetbrains C++ IDE demo." :P
 
not that either!
@Potatoswatter meant in general
tools kinda suck compared to other languages
(I'm reading about text editors et al for other languages)
Maybe in 2031
 
6:18 AM
VS's code map is nice. Also the profiler.
 
@Borgleader Your A a({B()); code is MVP.
 
@MarkGarcia Hmm wow, been a while since I've been bitten by that.
In fact I was pretty sure it wasn't because of B()
 
That is why I'm starting to love copy initialization!
 
you mean brace init?
 
6:27 AM
Copy-initialization (the grammatical concept) is when you use the = sign. It's another way to avoid MVP.
 
Oh
I honestly would use brace init more but to this day MSVC still have issues with it =/
And I'm still waiting for an LLVM Snapshot Build that doesn't choke on RTTI.
 
I'm not sure any compiler has worked out all the kinks, including brace elision. It's a thicket of near-ambiguity.
 
@Borgleader I personally don't like brace init's look (and just the looks), and doing T x = init; is just easy to spot. I'm actually starting to embrace the AAA style (auto x = T(init); just for this.
 
hm
TIL Doxygen can generate those .qch files
 
6:40 AM
hm well damn
it works
at least it doesn't crash my qt creator like C++ reference
 
-1
Q: How to remove ban user in chat form bot

jokerIn chat room we have a bot, i command to it to ban me using !!ban @joker. now how can i reverse this command

^^ Is it just me or does the OP sound like an idiot?
 
I know, let's use bots to detect the bots. And bots to detect the false positives and remove the bans too.
 
Anyone who directly asks a bot to ban them probably deserves it. — BoltClock's a Unicorn 1 min ago
 
ahahaha
 
alright, I am still missing something here... what on Earth are axioms for in C++ Concepts if the compiler can't verify them... might as well put them in comments?
 
6:48 AM
@ScarletAmaranth An axiom is by definition something that doesn't get verified. I thought those were dropped in the move to Concepts Lite?
 
axioms in C++ seem to be contract based programming
iunno if the proposal I read was super ancient though
Luc insists it isn't but it sure as hell reads like it
 
I think they were supposed to be a form of metadata to inform potential generic methods what semantics the given operations (which are only really grammatical requirements) implement.
 
yeah, you would for example state that
x > y <=> y <= x
I mean, why not in comments, not like it can be verified
why promote it to "axioms" and have syntax for it
I can't wrap my head around it
 
@ScarletAmaranth Because then the SFINAE (or whatever equivalent) can ask whether x < y has a particular meaning and not just that it's a valid expression.
 
@Potatoswatter so a user just says it is so, but the compiler can't verify?
almost like a concept map sort of thing?
I can do this:
 
6:52 AM
@ScarletAmaranth It's just inductive reasoning. I don't really see what it accomplishes that type traits doesn't. I haven't really looked in depth because it seems so esoteric, and some examples contradict each other.
 
@ScarletAmaranth wow there are a lot of people on that list o.o
 
@Potatoswatter yeah, that's the thing, I understand the "concepts lite" very well, I just can't see why they're saying that they're "shittier version of fully fledged concepts"
 
We don't really need an equality_is_transitive trait because by convention equality is always transitive. Concepts beyond Lite is a solution in search of a problem far as I've seen…
 
for instance, I could say that for Equality comparable, you need to have operator== and operator!=, that's nice and dandy
but then having something like "equivalence relationship" stating semantics of == is nice but the compiler can't do jack about it, it can only hope it's true
 
Have you tried debugging the program? Stepping through it to see why that happens? — Borgleader 1 min ago
 
6:55 AM
@Borgleader Concepts were/is a big deal
it's been a hot issue since at least the original STL existed
 
@Rapptz do you have any idea as to how exactly the semantic part being "compilable" helps?
 
I think axioms are stupid, so no
I think the common argument was something that'll help compiler optimisation or something but that one is thrown around 24/7.
 
well, I have been watching the recent development and it does seem that they don't want to stop at "constraints" or "concepts lite" or wahtever
 
they never did
why else would it be named Concepts Lite :v
you need a follow up
I doubt people are willing to throw out 15+ years of work
 
good, but then, what will "true Concepts" have that Concepts lite don't if concepts lite do something similar to what Type classes do
 
6:59 AM
alright sleep attempt #2
 
@Borgleader gl! :)
 
Concept maps are cool
tbh I think Concepts Lite is a mistake
 
well, they said they would be discarding concept maps entirely
 
I also would have liked the original syntax for making concepts
 
@Rapptz Top-down optimization, i.e. algorithm analysis, is a research area unto itself. There definitely needs to be an example of something actually getting optimized before the idea of automatically improving C++ programs is credible.
It's just the kind of masturbation fantasy vaporware that Stephen Wolfram would go on selling for decades.
 
7:02 AM
Yeah I don't take that statement very heavily.
I usually ignore it.
also atm the syntax for making concepts is way too brace-y
 
mmm, the Concepts seem arcane as soon as we leave the realm of "operator!= and operator== need to exist"
 
this is the most up to date syntax:
template<typename T>
concept bool Range =
    requires(T range) {
        { begin(range) } -> Iterator_type<T>;
        { end(range) }  -> Iterator_type<T>;
        requires Iterator<Iterator_type<T>>;
    };
 
What does requires Iterator<Iterator_type<T>>; do?
 
iunno
 
it's a nested requires expression that checks an extra concept
 
7:04 AM
makes sense, I guess
 
turns out I chose an interesting BSc topic :)
 
Meh, the search doesn't work and I can't find that example.
 
I still don't like how brace-y it is
The example is from niebler's blog
the guy is acquainted with sutton and asked him for the syntax before he wrote it so I trust it's correct
 
I wish I could cite blogs in my thesis
 
Oh, I see. Iterator_type is an alias template for typename T::iterator. And Iterator is a predicate that returns whether the given type is an Iterator.
 
Bah.
 
@Potatoswatter I'm assuming Iterator is a concept, not a predicate
though I suppose they're the same thing lol
meta function or trait can also be applicable
 
well, concepts are basically constexprs that return bools
 
syntactic sugar for SFINAE :v
 
very much so
that's why the semantic part doesn't quite make a whole bunch of sense
 
7:08 AM
Is it possible to get Travis CI working with Clang that is capable of C++11? It appears that the version that is there pre-installed is not C++11 capable. All my attempts at installing any newer version end up failing because of this:
In file included from /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.8/../../../../include/c++/4.8/bits/move.h:57:

/usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.8/../../../../include/c++/4.8/type_traits:269:39: error:

use of undeclared identifier '__float128'

struct __is_floating_point_helper<__float128>
 
undefined reference Travis CI at line 1, aborting compilation
 
I have this thing ^
which is C++11 syntactic sugar for SFINAE :P
 
I made a similar thing for my BSc. only to be told I shouldn't include it, because it's not supposed to be a compilation of concepts, but rather an overview of sorts : - /
 
hmmmmmm
require or requires
who wants to bikeshed
:D
I think I'll go with requires, it reads better
 
the bikeshed should be green
 
7:12 AM
and it's what I wrote in my erroneous example.
 
oh well, I think I will include axioms in my BSc thesis and conclude they suck and a better way needs to be sought after
:: fin ::
 
7:31 AM
this doxygen qch thing is pretty great
 
It's from Qt
 
user3010322
7:56 AM
Mmm. Documentatio.
 
user3010322
Well, now that things are right-side-up in my raytracer and I'm no longer that much of a moron,
 
user3010322
I can start doing fancy things with it. And porting things to openGL.
 
8:10 AM
porting raytracer to opengl?
do you want to hand write a compute shader for the tracing process?
(I wrote GPGPU for it but I suspect it actually generates a compute shader for me)
 
user3010322
The part that displays the image to screen is powered by Realtime graphics.
 
user3010322
So either DirectX or OpenGL or Mantle would be the underlying API for that.
 
I have my gpgpu computed stuff bound to a texture which is then rendered by d3d
 
user3010322
Also there's the whole rest of the engine, so.
 
user3010322
8:12 AM
@ScarletAmaranth Ah.
 
the interop I don't even know how I got working
 
user3010322
@ScarletAmaranth Part of me suspects that in the end the C++ AMP stuff really is just being compiled to compute shaders on the back end.
 
I just stole some code from Ade Miller's book
I can't write compute shaders : - /
 
user3010322
How they're doing that exactly, I'm not sure. They must have a complicated source processor that takes the C++ source and writes it to certain kinds of shaders and then does all the binding and setting-up for you.
 
all I know is my code kiiinda looks alright and like C++
there are still some stupid restirctions
such as I can't keep all the geometry in a single container
I have to iterate over spheres first, then over triangles, etc.
 
user3010322
8:15 AM
mmm.
 
well, I have each pixel as a separate entity so there is no need for communication between threads; my raytracer parallelizes trivially
 
user3010322
That's the idea. No one pixels of a raytracer really depends on the other, so once all the state is set up its just go time.
 
user3010322
GPU lends itself to massive per-pixel parallelizations, so.
 
sure, but the thing is, I have done some research on certain techniques that would potentially speed things up
but would sacrifice this nice "isolated" property
 
user3010322
I don't see how?
 
8:20 AM
well, if you know there's a big sphere blocking the camera, there's no need to shoot million a ray
 
user3010322
Ah. Corner-case heuristics.
 
the idea is that as soon as you have some "higher view" than per pixel, you can infer quite a bit not only in corner cases really
 
user3010322
I'd buy that idea. I'm just not so sure what I'd be able to do with it. :D
 
user3010322
Because dumb.
 
user3010322
8:36 AM
Oh.
 
user3010322
Ihave a big refactor to do.
 
user3010322
I need to fix mathema.
 
user3010322
Hm.
 
user3010322
I need some math constants, but in the desired type...
 
user3010322
I'd like a good syntax for that. Maybe constants::pi<int>::value ?
 
user3010322
8:39 AM
Looks... messy.
 
user3010322
pi<float> ... I don't know if that's possible. It'd be my ideal syntax, though.
 
user3010322
Maybe I should make a class template <T> pi_t, implicit conversion to T with the value of the constant.
 
user3010322
I actually somewhat like that idea, but. I'd have to instantiate the class everytime I wanted to use it.
 
user3010322
float fpi = pi_t<float>(); // converts down now
 
user3010322
Kinda strange.
 
user3010322
8:43 AM
I actually wonder if just pi_t<float> would work.
 
user3010322
Sadface is SAD.
 
I made my Allegro binding better :toot:
 
user3010322
Sweet.
 
user3010322
Quick question.
 
user3010322
8:52 AM
The result of a using alias must be a type, right?
 
@ThePhD It can also be a template type.
 
user3010322
Yeah. So just types.
 
user3010322
Well, okay.
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus Kinky. It is a lot simpler.
 
user3010322
8:54 AM
Heh.
 
user3010322
No matter what I do, I can't get this to automatically instantiate an pi and then give me the pi of the desired type.
 
user3010322
Ah well. S'what I get.
 
user3010322
And thus, we're back to just regular free functions.
 
Calling al_keycode_to_name corrupts the heap apparently
 
user3010322
9:00 AM
o.0
 
Fun With FFI
Also VS keeps removing Allegro DLL from output directory instead of copying it :cripes:
 
user3010322
Lol
 
user3010322
Nice.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Okay and what happens with the winning logo now?
@ThePhD const double PI = 3.141592653589793; problem solved.
 
user3010322
Not fancy enough. =[
 
9:13 AM
So, which one was Jet again
PhD's?
 
user3010322
No, that was Jeffffrey's, I think
 
user3010322
The one with teh mousetache-looking couch?
 
user3010322
It doesn't show up on the results page.
 
@ThePhD constexpr double PI = 2*acos(0);?
 
user3010322
Because Robot goofed.
 
9:14 AM
I thought you did that one
Welp
 
user3010322
I didn't make a logo in time. :D
 
@Jefffrey Report for favicon making duty at earliest convenienc
 
user3010322
@FredOverflow I meant, like. float f = PI; // warning about conversion and sizes and shit
 
user3010322
So I was thinking float f = pi<float>();
 
user3010322
Where it would automatically static_cast for me. :D
 
9:19 AM
Why would you want a floating pi?
You really want as much accuracy as possible.
 
user3010322
Some computations I don't want to promote to double-and-float or float-and-double and just want to be computed all the way through with floats.
 
user3010322
Arrgh I can't specialize template functions. =[[[
 
You pick a size and stick with it. The last thing you want is to be converting back and forth.
 
user3010322
Why am I not allowed to specialize template functions? :c
 
because of some profound reason that would break the type system
in a scenario that has never ever ocurred in real code
 
9:26 AM
FWIW, some compilers will promote intermediate results to double. That can fuck up performance.
 
Some intermediate result promotions happen to improve performance, just because the hardware is double-precision.
@ThePhD You can fully specialize function templates, but it's always a bad idea. Partial specialization would be an equally bad idea, and it solves the same problem as either overloading or dispatching, which already work fine.
 
user3010322
Well, the goal here is to write as little code as possible.
 
Wrong language then!
 
use ALGOL
 
user3010322
u.u; But... but C++ so naice. :c
 
9:31 AM
Install Eigen.
 
user3010322
I dun waannnnnaaaaa
 
use COBOL
 
Writing as little as possible does not a fast math library make.
 
@Potatoswatter wisdom in your words there is
 
user3010322
I need a place to put my lanczos and gaussian functions.
 
user3010322
9:33 AM
Maybe I can just stick them in a namespace somewhere and call it a day.
 
user3010322
What to call that namespace...
 
Hungary:: and Germany::
 
user3010322
heh.
 
teheehee
 
user3010322
maybe just namespace mathema
 
9:36 AM
kernel
 
user3010322
kernel?
 
They are convolution kernel functions.
 
I've got this!
freeFunctions::
 
user3010322
I guess so.
 
mmm, but I usually use upper case for namespaces
I wonder whether that's a bad idea
 
9:38 AM
Nah, using REPLACEMENT CHARACTER or BYTE ORDER MARK for an identifier is a bad idea.
 
I don't mind lengthy identifier descriptions
better than int a
 
@ThePhD Why? x87 computes with 64 or 80 bits, anyway.
 
@FredOverflow Modern CPUs don't even do x87 natively.
 
iirc it always computes in some higher precision and truncates the result if needed
 
@Potatoswatter Surprisingly the 80-bit operation latencies are identical to that of the SIMD double precision. So the hardware is still there.
 
9:44 AM
-fstrict-math is your friend if you want control over intermediate result precision (I think, can't speak from experience)
 
Intel can't nerf the performance of the x87 FPU. Too many legacy benchmarks rely on it.
 
:lol: benchmarks
 
But they do occasionally nerf the performance of newer instruction sets which few people use.
 
@Mysticial do you think that if backward compatibility wasn't required, processors could take "leaps" forward?
 
Neither do they really care about keeping it at the same pace as SSE.
 
9:46 AM
@ScarletAmaranth Of course.
 
Does that need to be said?
Backward compat is always horrible for improvement
 
Has anyone yet benchmarked Haswell transactional memory?
 
Nope
Not me.
 
user3010322
Hmhm.
 
We cannot be certain about this new and amazing marvel of technology.
 
9:55 AM
lol, I was excited about the FMA3 and AVX2 instructions.
 
user3010322
Hm. I should rename MiniMax to clamp
 
user3010322
Mmm. clamps.
 
@MarkGarcia thanks :)
 
What logo was it, anyway? I can't see any images on the results page.
 
10:03 AM
@CatPlusPlus ok
 
Ah, I didn't understand the scaled-down version. Nice.
@PeeHaa Nice name…
 
Tnx potato
:)
 
user3010322
Why isn't std::sin overloaded for float, and instead has a different function std::sinf ?
 
because C
 
user3010322
That doesn't stop the C++ standard from kicking up a new overload in the std namespace?
 
10:11 AM
They're templates from C++11
double sin( Integral arg );
(Also they have overloads and I'm selectively blind)
 
@ThePhD tbh I can't find sinf anywhere
 
It's in math.h
 
then my initial answer applies
 
user3010322
Well, MSVC doesn't have the float overloads in the std::sin function, so I guess I'm templating.
 
The correct answer is "because MSVC" then
 
10:14 AM
that's a common answer to most of the problems in here
 
user3010322
Oh, nope.
 
user3010322
There it is.
 
user3010322
MSVC is fine then.
 
user3010322
Yay~
 
10:15 AM
@Cat I saw your repo :). The Jam was a successful idea, I guess :)
 
10:26 AM
-1
A: Array passing to a method in C++

rajenpanditif you declare an array then the variable holds the base address of that array, so here char c[3] means c holds the base address of the array c[3]. so, when you are passing Reverse(c,3); actually you are passing the base address.

...not again...
 
@ThePhD std::sin is overloaded for float. ::sinf is a function in <math.h>, I don't think std::sinf is, and anyway you wouldn't use it.
 
user3010322
@Potatoswatter So I'm gathering.
 
@CatPlusPlus sin fail…
 
@Potatoswatter <cmath> would include a std::sinf if there's ::sinf in <math.h>
 
@DeadMG Are you sure? I think special rules apply to that part of the library. Anyway, using it seems like just a bad idea.
 
user3010322
10:31 AM
Well, it seems gcc, clang, and vc++ have float overloads for std::sin, so as long as I'm not using the c-version, I am fine.
 
Yesterday our architect consultant explained that commiting every fourteen days is the standard in the industry. (Commit your stuff at the end of each sprint)
 
@Potatoswatter I doubt any special rules apply, but it is quite plausible that sinf is a C99 invention and the C++ Standard only requires C89's contents.
 
Merging would not be a problem
 
@JohanLarsson wat
even I know that's wrong.
 
@DeadMG what I said also, so I asked for a clarification and then he explained it
nice of him to share his knowledge
 
10:33 AM
probably means committing to the master branch, maybe?
 
@JohanLarsson What, but you're not as nice? ;)
 
@DeadMG we use tfs and only have a master branch, dunno if there is something like local commits
 
Yeah, I think DeadMG has it. For a larger company, integration is a project unto itself and development teams would commit to the integration team, which would in turn produce something every sprint.
 
Think about the expression std::move(list.front()) in isolation. If std::move did actually move its argument (hint: it does not), where exactly would the object be moved to? — FredOverflow 1 min ago
I hope this ends all illusions of std::move doing a move once and for all.
 
I asked if there would be a point in having a master and a dev branch and merge dev to master when dev is working, that would be pointless he said
 
10:36 AM
To be fair, life is pointless.
 
@Potatoswatter I have no skill, hence nothing to share :)
 
@JohanLarsson :laffo:
 
@JohanLarsson The joke is that you told us he was nice to share his knowledge, and then paused for a while.
 
He's a fucking moron and a hack
 
10:38 AM
@JohanLarsson lol
 
Maybe committing every 14 days is standard in talentless hack ~~architect~~ industry, but has nothing to do with softdev
Seriously, whoever calls themselves an "architect" in context of softdev is an idiot
Everyone, no exceptions
 
@Potatoswatter the point is the one you make for yourself
if you forgot to generate a point, that's too bad
 
@Jefffrey There's a dirty joke in there somewhere.
 
Life by default does not have a point. But none is stopping you to define your own goals.
no dirt
 
Yay, Steam library sharing is live
 
10:48 AM
you mean, family sharing?
 
@StackedCrooked what is the procedure for updating Wide on Coliru anyways
@CatPlusPlus Maybe they're a building architect who wants software developed for them? :P
 
2 days ago, by Johan Larsson
Cat & BabyDog, it would be so nice to have you in Sweden for our design meetings right now. I sound very much like you when rejecting all the crap that gets thrown around.
 
@DeadMG You ask and hope it'll be updated
 
still applies, bring large bins for teh large designs
 
10:53 AM
lol
 
how is health?
 
same old same old
 
11:09 AM
are all the doctors so terrible there?
 
yep
 
11:56 AM
are tfs work items good/useful?
 
IME TFS is a mess that doesn't really help with organisation
 
yeah I have only used tfs for a week but am really unimpressed
is your advice to not use work items?
 
I don't remember what those are
 
I always feel old and dumb when working with version control
 
12:14 PM
@JohanLarsson I always feel dumb when working without... "oh shit I shouldn't have deleted the old function"
 
I always use it of course
I sometimes roulette merge (just click to use random file)
 
@FredOverflow It goes on the wiki
 
production.php.erb is really funny for some reason
 
user1804599
Do you generate PHP code using Ruby? :P
 
I'm moving loungecpp dot net apps to Capistrano
 
12:23 PM
'error LNK2019: unresolved external' - OK, but I wonder what all the other errors, LNK0001' to 'LNK2018', are?

Linkers scare me. I have nightmares..
 
It's always fun to peek at the list string constants in a piece of software. But my guess is that there are (at least) two categories of errors, and that's #19 in the category 2.
 
@ScottW hoy :)
 
Xeo
@MartinJames 2xxx is linker error, 4xxx is compiler
@CatPlusPlus eh, or not
I thought there was a system to it :/
 
@Xeo Thanks! Now I will sleep easier 'cos I know there can only be 1999 different linker errors:)
 

« first day (1232 days earlier)      last day (3706 days later) »