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12:14 AM
@Jimbo Oh wow, so do I!!!
Having the "fiend responsible for [...]" verbatim makes me happy
 
user895378
12:38 AM
lol
 
user895378
> and was the fiend responsible for the removal of Logo GUIDs in PHP 5.5
 
user895378
glorious
 
I chuckled that they found drama in the process surprising.
Drama and PHP internals should never be surprising.
 
e'ning @rdlowrey. Just out of curiosity, what are you going to do with your current business now that you're going to get a 'real' job? obviously none of my business, just wondering.
 
user895378
Well considering it's mostly automated at this point I hope it functions as a largely passive revenue stream
 
12:43 AM
\o/ - the best type of revenue stream.
 
Anyone who would care to, please give me an eli5 definition of "upload" and "download"
6
@rdlowrey @Trowski @kelunik @ircmaxell especially if you can (will unpin in 24hr)
 
@rdlowrey Fly out once a month to meet them?
 
sorry for multiping :-(
 
user895378
I hope not. I'm not sure though. I'll just have to let folks know I'm doing some internal restructuring. If it becomes a hassle, though, we'll just see.
 
@rdlowrey the kind of customers you would have I imagine would be all about Skype etc anyway, although I admit I'm basically picturing 80s guy from Futurama
 
12:47 AM
@DaveRandom "computers can send information such as pictures or movies or other information to other computers. Uploading is when you're sending something from your computer to another one. Downloading is when your computer is getting something from another computer".
/sounds like a tough job interview there Dave.
 
@DaveRandom Are you looking for an analogy or more a technical definition "dumbed" down?
 
user895378
@DaveRandom you might be surprised. It's mainly just crazy people like the guy in the movie Pi who need more data for their world-conquering algorithms
 
I'm happy for you @rdlowrey but I have to admit the selfish part of me was a little sad that you got a real job. I'm afraid you won't have time for your OSS libraries anymore :(
 
@Danack Actually dual purpose. Was thinking of getting involved with code club or similar and trying to get into a mindset, and trying to settle a semi-philosophical debate with a friend - I'll explain all afterwards but don't want to taint the results (as it were)
@cspray Yeh pretty much
 
user895378
@cspray Nah I'm sure I will. I can't just abandon years of work ... especially work I believe is very worthwhile.
 
12:51 AM
> trying to get into a mindset
 
Go for Up-goer 5 style if you prefer
 
In that case my advice is never use analogies, only ever use simple terms.
 
@Danack Of explaining complicated things without cruft
@Danack this
@rdlowrey If you get to go have a meeting at Larry and Sergey's lair in a volcano that I'm pretty certain they have, do not say no
 
People fixate on the details of analogies without actually understanding.....whereas using simple terms allows them to understand....and if they don't understand they can ask for clarification, rather than misleading themselves into thinking they understand when they don't.
btw @rdlowrey, is it okay to tag a new RC version of Artax to include that last bug fix I submitted? Not sure if I have the power to do so...haven't tried yet.
 
I find it kind of interesting that I have no issue speaking to 20 7-year-olds and I would run screaming from a conf talk, but it's very much the other way round for 1-on-1 social situations
 
user895378
12:55 AM
@DaveRandom interesting
 
@Danack push is push afaik
@rdlowrey I wonder if the logical reverse is true :-P
 
user895378
@Danack Well, considering artax is about to get the long-overdue total rewrite ... I'm not sure how to handle. I may just need to tag what's there now as 1.0.0 and make it clear that's not going to receive much in the way of real support going forward
 
@DaveRandom btw have you watched all of Feynman's lectures where he explains things? youtube.com/watch?v=EKWGGDXe5MA
 
omg I suck at typing I'm so sorry
 
user895378
As I think @ircmaxell can now attest I become hyper-social in person.
 
12:57 AM
@rdlowrey That also works for me.
 
user895378
Can't stop talking. But I'm also so interesting so it's okay lol.
 
@rdlowrey Yeh I've always imagined that for some reason... possibly the number of debates about illicit substances we've had :-P
 
user895378
True story ...
 
btw for anyone who doesn't know, Phil Sturgeon is one of the best people I've ever met to get really pissed with
He is a generally sound guy
 
user895378
Immediately after Nick (one of the Grovo founders) handed me my job offer in a folder I launched into a discussion of "what's the most illegal thing you guys have ever done?"
 
user895378
12:59 AM
Anthony was mortified lol
 
@DaveRandom "Your computer is on the ground. Clouds are in the sky. Your best friend is called Ennesay, she lives in the clouds. Uploading is when you give Ennesay things. She's high in the sky, so you need to throw the things up! That's why it's called uploading. Downloading is when things fall from the sky... they fall down to you! Ennesay is really mean, though. You can give her things all day, but she never lets anything fall back down to you."
2
 
@rdlowrey protip: never watch a video of yourself chatting shit on E
@Andrea Interestingly this falls on the other side of the underlying philosophical debate from Dan's
 
@DaveRandom heh
 
@DaveRandom Another one to add to your watch list youtube.com/watch?v=4zZbX_9ru9U
 
btw gratz @Andrea on conf talk acceptance! Looking forward to it :-)
 
1:02 AM
@DaveRandom thanks :3
 
@Andrea please make sure it will be recorded for posterity
 
@DaveRandom "Pieces of a file can be shared across computers. When you get pieces from another computer it is downloading. When you give pieces to another computer it is uploading."
 
@marcio They recorded last year, I'm sure they'll record this year
 
@Danack I have actually watched that many times, I have basically everything I've ever been able to find related to Feynman, to the point that I still prefer his Cosmos, even though Tyson's is technically better in every way, and he is also very good at fronting it, it's like the new Thunderbirds, it's just not the same
 
:)
 
1:07 AM
@Andrea It'll be fine. You can come round to mine and I'll set the Everything Is OK alarm off if you want, that usually fixes things
 
Ennesay is my best friend! She's so nice. She really cares about me. She has a good friend named Drzisiesz-kju who she always plays with.
(to continue that explanation)
 
@cspray The start bothers me, because it somehow seems to imply that a whole file can't be sent, only pieces of it
 
@DaveRandom Yea, I thought about that afterwards
My point was to start a conversation about the fact that it isn't really a whole file and to get into bits and packets and other stuff
 
/me smokes
 
If that's too technical then just rip out the pieces part
"A file can be shared across computers. When you get a file from another computer it is downloading. When you give a file to another computer it is uploading."
 
1:10 AM
My biggest issue through all of this is to try and define "data" (I realise that seems weird so laugh as you will)
 
@cspray kids today don't know what files are.....they know about pictures, videos and other documents.
 
/me really smokes
 
Ah, sorry, my Polish is pretty bad. The name of Ennesay's friend is properly spelled Dzisieć-kju.
(I really hope someone gets that...)
 
@rdlowrey perhaps it got more stable because people simply elided the references from their code instead of making bug reports :>
 
user895378
haha if so that should be considered a win, right? :)
 
1:18 AM
it's not true ofc, but I couldn't post on twitter and promote more php defamation.
 
user895378
hehe true true
 
but it's true that, after some regressions, it did got more stable recently. 8 days without a segfault.
 
@marcio They are a ticking time-bomb.
They'll just break again some day.
You are better off without them.
 
@LeviMorrison we found a single legit use case discussing here: closures that need to reference itself.
 
1:36 AM
@marcio I really really want to believe you have a simpsons-style "day's since the last segfault" board behind you with number paddles on
If you're anything like me, usually set at 0
@marcio That's just a hack over something there should be a specific way to do though
 
@DaveRandom EXACTLY
 
I'm really struggling to think of something non-horrible though
The obvious thing is $this but it won't work for obvious reasons
and another magic var is horrible, a magic const is even more horrible, and I can't come up with a sane syntax without a symbol
You could possibly do something with the function keyword but I can't figure anything out
 
speaking about hack, Hacklang has 'fun' docs.hhvm.com/manual/en/function.hack.fun.php
it could serve as a reference
 
@marcio I personally prefer the idea of a full callable type and the (function) cast
Actually if you could special-case closure declarations such that $var = function() use ($var) would capture the self-reference inside the closure that might work
although it would get crappy for anything other than straight var assignments
function() use(self $var) and $var has self-ref maybe? So the self keyword indicates that the var will have it
I could live with that, no magic vars and no keyword conflicts
 
1:53 AM
hmm, that's the only way to avoid the reference currently 3v4l.org/1hFBd
@DaveRandom that doesn't seem doable without a new magic var, like $this.
 
@marcio Yeh that's fraught with difficulty, but an explicit decl in the use block seems fine to me, since there are no hints there it has no conflict or ambiguity
 
@marcio I've never understood why you can't self-reference with __FUNCTION__ or __CLOSURE__ or something.
 
@LeviMorrison A magic constant for this would be horrible imho
 
@DaveRandom we have self, maybe we could use self() 3v4l.org/U6GdM
 
Not least because of __CLOSURE__() behaviour
 
2:06 AM
@marcio Self is bound to the context the closure exists in…
 
15 mins ago, by DaveRandom
function() use(self $var) and $var has self-ref maybe? So the self keyword indicates that the var will have it
 
@DaveRandom I didn't follow that.
 
@DaveRandom I saw that, I don't love the use(self $var) part...
 
@LeviMorrison __CLOSURE__() calls the function named __CLOSURE__, not the Closure object the constant contains because PHP symbols rules are stupid
 
Don't use self – that has to do with binding.
 
2:09 AM
maybe callable(), it's already a keyword and has no special meaning outside argument lists: 3v4l.org/UsCJ3
 
@DaveRandom So (__CLOSURE__)() is sub-optimal – what other problems?
 
but semantically, it's not fine.
 
@marcio It logically belongs in the use() block because that's the part where you declare the things you are importing into the function scope, which is where the ref is coming from. It has no syntactic conflicts because there are no hints there. It uses an existing keyword so no new ones.
 
How often do you really need to reference the closure within itself?
 
Callbacks that use recursion sounds like something that people would do, but I admit I never have
 
2:13 AM
@Trowski in a scale of 0..10, a 3, but it could be a 4. It's just that I avoid needing it by design because the limitation is known already.
 
Or timers that reschedule themselves?
 
@DaveRandom I have used it for this.
Not saying there aren't good uses, just it seems like you're trying to solve a problem that has a solution.
 
@Trowski a recursive parser on a parser combinator
 
@Trowski It has a hack around the lack of a proper solution
 
I use a self-referencing closure in my coroutine implementation :-)
 
2:15 AM
And a leaky error-prone hack at that
 
Can't you just use two closures to avoid the self-referencing?
 
Hmm.... most of my potential suggestions have already been covered it seems.
 
$fn = function($x, $fn) {
};
$selfFn = function($x) use ($fn) {
    $fn($x, $fn);
};
"the lack of a proper solution" - closures don't exist until they are created....I'm not sure being able to reference something that doesn't exist is a proper solution either.
 
@Danack Does the fact that your brain came up with this honestly not feel like a hack to you? :-P
 
I never said it's not a hack....
 
2:23 AM
@Danack that something does exists, we're just speculating if there could be a way to reference the __invoke of that thing.
@Danack I ended up doing this some days ago :)
 
As I said, it doesn't exist at the time when you create it....being able to forward declare references to things.....seems weird.
 
Alright guys, here's one that's had me stumped:
//  some application service: to update email

// begin transaction
$user = $userRepo->findById($id);
$email = $userRepo->isEmailUnique($email);  // <-- domain leak to app layer?
$user->updateEmail($email);
$userRepo->save($user);
// end transaction
 
@Danack it does exists, the closure object is something initialized apart it's own function, the same way the methods are things apart the objects.
 
@Ocramius any thoughts on above code? How do you justify that the app layer needs to remember to do things like: call a repo (or call a domain service) before calling an entity behavior in the same transaction?
 
Morning
 
2:34 AM
Which leads me to the question, how many separate aggregate/entity method calls should an app make in a single transaction (we can even assume they are from the same aggregate if you want)? As many as it wants as long as each stays within some conception/transaction boundary (kind of an abstract answer)?
 
@prograhammer i almost feel like email should be an entity itself... It has identity and a lifetime that is relevant to your app.
 
@Orangepill o/
 
Good morning
 
@Orangepill btw I missed typed that. That probably should have been some IF condition there...
So let's say the email address is an entity, we still have the same problem. I mean we could capture the whole thing in a single domain service, but that seems wrong. The unique email belongs to user.
and as far as the business conception is, the unique email is just part of creating or updating a user.
 
@prograhammer but given the constraint that it is unique removes it from being a simple value object.
 
2:50 AM
well, what if I were to say it gives the user identity?
 
The spec for the update email could then create a new email entity and giving a nonunique email would cause creation to fail
The fact that the email can change makes it a poor means to denote the identity of the user
I'm in the midst of reading Eric Evans so I might not be stating the correct strategy for this... Just thinking out loud
 
Morning
I need to create a web server. But I need to run a script that contain
while(true)
I need to run in once and run forever on cron job. any idea? Thanks for expert
 
@prograhammer maybe the right answer is to create an email update service that can enforce the uniqueness while not requiring the user object to be repository aware
 
Abe
3:17 AM
aye aye
morning o/
 
morning \o
 
Abe
@prograhammer in some ddd&cqrs code i checked, domain objects/aggregates have access to repositories, so when you change an email it is still the domain object/aggregate to check if it's not already taken
class User{
    function setEmail($email){
        if($this->repository->getByEmail($email))
            throw new Exception;
        $this->email = $email;
    }
cc @Orangepill
 
@abe the bidirectional dependency seems messy though
 
Abe
one of key of ddd is freeing services from any domain logic whatsoever. everything must stay in the aggregates
 
3:35 AM
That would require constructing the object with an instance of its repository right
 
Abe
hm?
i don't know the "how" yet though
need to find the time to start a new project and test some ddd
 
I think the problem all but goes away if you treat the unique value as an entity itself. Email in this case
 
@Orangepill @Abe sorry, my wife turned of my laptop, LOL
let me read and catch up here...
@Orangepill I'm actually in the midst of reading the red book
Implementing DDD
Vaughn's book
 
I'm in the lobby of a largely WiFi free resort on a tablet so forgive my slowness
That's going to be my next read
 
the "unique validation" problem is a common one, but I'm not yet seeing the solution that I feel is right/canon. For example: stackoverflow.com/questions/16827710/unique-validation-in-ddd
That link is one of many that ask the same question in DDD
 
3:48 AM
I know answers are across the board
 
@Abe I thought that would be ok at first, using the repo in certain situations from inside the entity....
but @Ocramius talked me out of it. And I searched through and read in Vernon Vaughn's red book that it's not recommended
 
Maybe a Specification bound to the user that enfoces the constant is the ticket
*constraint
 
@Orangepill yeah several say the specification is the ticket. But I'm not seeing what exactly that buys the client. The client (in this case the application service) still needs to know enough to grab the spec from somewhere (entity? separate class in the aggregate folder with suffix "specification"?) then pass it to the repo or something then give it back to the entity.
Requiring the client to know that is a domain leak, right?
Which brings me to the question: how much (methods on an aggregate) can an application call in a transaction?
 
Should be pretty low I would think
If you are doing to much in the client then there is probably something missing from the domain model
 
It seems like, at the aggregate root, we would think about the behavior entry points as: 1. commands our app would run (like, out in the UI or Console or API). 2. domain service behaviors needed (for those times we need a domain service to call something in more than one aggregate)
The behavior wouldn't actually be commands (those would be in an application layer, coming accross a command bus, etc). But that's how we would get a list of the behaviors we need. The rest of the aggregate behind the root is like a "mini-project" helping us accomplish those behaviors that ultimately make up a whole single buisiness concept. A concept that has state, state we can persist.
The aggregate is bound by our transactions. If the business calls for a transaction of something, then we have to accomplish that within an aggregate (no multiple aggregates). SO that helps us decide the boundary of things an aggregate can do.
I'm just talking out of my head. I have a lot of reading to do. But I'm coding while I read, LOL.
 
4:06 AM
So I think if you are doing too many aggregate method calls in the client that is an indication of functionality needed in aggregate itself
 
At least deserves a hard look
 
Basically, you should be getting almost 1:1 on your commands coming in from the app (just speculating here). However, it's possible that you can have a set of methods that can be called in any order, and are all atomic, and stay within a transaction and use the same state the aggregate keeps. That would be fine.
Personnally, I'd say the less the application layer has to remember, the better. But the application layer is the only place for handling this "gateway" stuff. Like pull from repository, save to repository. Or in this unique email situation, query the repository. "Query" as in "don't get an entity". Just get some data to use.
 
I know that the 1:1 command to aggregate method is what is suggested by @Ocramius.... Duplication to be removed in refactoring
 
The scary part that I'm having to overcome is "letting the database layer go". I mean, I might have 2 different aggregates that are using the same tables.
 
4:13 AM
Unless the specification is supplied to the user at the time that the repository creates it
 
Overall, DDD is helping tremendously. It's freed my app from the database (I can serve aggregates however I want, from AWS, from mysql, from flat nosql tables, mix it up). I can test aggregates and repositories seperately. CQRS has added even more good seperation. I can focus on my writes (some reads needed in repository write side). I even could see application/database sharding as more possible.
 
Abe
@prograhammer and that can't be broken from the outside world
 
@Abe what do you mean? What is that?
You mean the domain service?
Yeah the domain service can have a repository dependency.
 
Abe
the state of the aggregate, you should not be allowed to break it from services
all the logic must stay within aggregates. you should avoid doing uniqueness validation within services
 
Well, the domain services are the one provision we have when we need to do something cross aggregate. But referencing multiple aggregates in one request doesn't give license to cause modification on two or more of them.
 
Abe
4:22 AM
i'm a bit lost i was still talking of validating the uniqueness of the email
 
When ever an application service or domain services calls behavior on aggregate roots, we are modifying the aggregate's state. The issue is we don't want bi-directional access there with the repository. The entities (aggregate root and entities) and VOs shouldn't be dependent on repositories. Repositories exist for more than just abstracting database access details, but they exist to keep persistence completely out of our entities
@Abe oh....and also I apologize, I'm on a tiny laptop
slow and bad writing
 
I think the right way is to bind a specification to the user that is repository aware and can assert the uniqueness of the email
 
So we bind a specification to the user entity. Like our DI binds it. And we do $user->getUniqueEmailSpec(); right?
 
The correct specification can be supplied to the factory at the time of construction of a new object and can be set by the repository at the time of hydration.
I don't know that the public interface of user even needs to be able to get the spec.
Would just be used internally to ensure it remained in a valid state
 
Abe
@Orangepill example of that? i'm failing to follow u :P anyway, i don't think UserDO knowing its own repository is that bad
 
4:31 AM
Let's not assume the unique email is determined on construction. Because I could see asking the repository for $userRepo->findByEmail($email); and it returns false and we "new" up the entity.
 
Abe
sometimes the simplest solution is the best
 
Yeah @Abe but the point of the exercise is to see how we manage to give entities information from the repository for certain behaviors to perform.
 
@abe you are probably right.. Just smells funny
 
I'm not using ORMs and lazy loading (ugh). So I could see myself needing to determine at some point how to go to repository and load up more things in my entity for certain behaviors.
 
Abe
another solution could be the repository installing an observer on all UserDO listening for the UserEmailChanged event
but idk, looks unnecessarily complicated
 
4:35 AM
@Abe true you just send message by post card :P
 
Abe
and that's a form of dependency anyway
 
morning
 
Abe
hey
 
It seems like the application layer has to manage all the "gateway" like stuff for the aggregate roots. Any lazy loading or unique checks, etc, we just have to have the application service know to call. THe methods on the aggregate root will be explicit. I'm just wondering what we could do on those methods that says "hey app service, you need to go do this for me and come back and give me this". Something that says it in code (no comments).
 
Abe
why are you calling it application layer? :P
uniqueness is more a domain logic thing imho
 
4:40 AM
Repository interfaces are in the domain layer. They are first class citizens.
So uniqueness would be a domain logic thing
 
Abe
> hey app service, you need to go do this for me and come back and give me this
and also, this is not different by knowing the repository, it's still a dependency
 
Yeah, that's what I'm wrestling with in my mind
 
Abe
that's the only solution
 
I suppose so. Specifications are just ways we can manage the complexity (if it gets to be too many things we need, we can use specifications). But ultimately the app service has to give us stuff from the repository. But again, we aren't talking bi-directional here. We just have explicit methods, not repositories injected.
 
Abe
eventually you will need to search other aggregates/entities/etc at some point. and that's a thing you can't avoid because the only other option you have is not realistic: downloading the entire users list as part of the aggregate and search for the email by looping on the collection
 
4:49 AM
Yeah, that's why I don't use Doctrine and try to fight that battle. I'd just have explicit methods that are like "$user->loadOrders(); $user->doSomethingOnOrders();"
It leaks some domain logic, as the app layer/new developers have to now remember these 2 things go together (domain logic)
 
Abe
what's $user->loadOrders() ?
 
"3. Business requirements lost in abstraction

Lazy loading sometimes hides some of the explicit business requirements away. If to perform some business logic I need to load a few things from database, I need that to be an explicit action and I want it to be readable. I want the next programmer taking over my code to know that to achieve that goal we need to load a few things from database. With lazy loading you do not know when something is loaded; you just call properties one after another without any real business meaning."
^ This is a senior guy from thoughworks (where Martin Fowler works) talking.
 
Abe
yes. lazy loading is a myth
the closest i get to that is what i can call "delayed loading"
basically i collect specs of what i need and i wait till the last moment to actually load them
sorry for the poor discussion though. i didn't get my coffee yet :( i'm really struggling focusing
 
It seems the trade-off (which I'm happy to pay) is I need to lose a bit of encapsulation. I may need the client to call a method on my entity before calling another method. He gives a good example:
"For example, you may need to load and check the last 100 orders for silver customers before authorizing a large payment while for gold customers you do not."
 
3v4l.org/VrYkp simplified version of what I was saying. Unique email spec would be supplied at in constructor and would be repository aware
I'm on a tablet so code writing is painful
 
Abe
5:01 AM
aware = agnostic you mean?
 
Would be constructed with an instance of the repo
 
So "customer" comes in from the UI. Gets on a command called "makeLargePayment". The domain will require the command call "$users->loadLast100Orders($repo->getOrder100($id))" before "$users->makePayment()";
<-- all writing painful here too. Super small keyboard
 
Well I got to get to bed... Talk to you guy later
 
@Abe and @Orangepill I'm actually willing to pick up this discussion on friday or weekend. I'm unable to properly hash it out on this laptop I'm on. Ugh.
I'm trying to get my head around this piece of DDD.
Sounds like I'll just call the repo from the app service for now. And look into what you are saying @Orangepill
bed time for me too
 
Abe
gn folks :P
 
5:07 AM
^ get another cup of coffee, you know, to go with that cup of coffee. :p
 
Abe
i "slept" with the window open and the summer suddenly ended tonight. rain & etc. i'm broken
i didn't actually sleep at all, basically. and too tired to get up and close the window xD
 
6:15 AM
Good morning
 
6:48 AM
moin
 
morning
 
moin
@Trowski someone is doing it github.com/krakjoe/pthreads/pull/477
 
morning
 
7:03 AM
@Patrick good morning
 
7:25 AM
Guys,
How do I apply the NOT logic to === ?
 
! (x === y)
morning btw!
 
Morning
 
@HassanAlthaf !==.
 
@kelunik Oh, thats what I guessed. ;P
@Naruto Thanks.
And thanks @kelunik
 
hi
can someone point me in the right direction please? as I can't find anything regarding the subject
it's about PDO bind_param
 
7:29 AM
@AlexAndrei just ask your question, and if people have the time they will answer you
 
when used with question mark placeholders
i saw this weird usage bind_param("ii",$var1,$var2);
 
@AlexAndrei in PDO, it is bindParam(':foo', 'value', DATATYPE);
 
it's working, but I don't find any reference to this usage
 
For data type, you put PDO::PARAM_*
 
yeah, i know
i'm talking about the type of usage i just posted
 
7:31 AM
bind_param is MySQLi
 
say you have this $pdo->prepare("select whatever from table limit ?,?); then
bindParam("ii",$var1,$var2);
yeah, sorry about that, it's PDO
 
bindParam with mysqli arguments?
Oh wait maybe
My speed is limited to cant check the documentation
8 KB/s -_-
 
all right, where does it say about the "ii" notation?
 
Nowhere because that is MySQLi shit, not PDO.
 
7:48 AM
it doesn't, it's PDO..
 
ok, sorry for wasting your time, it seems i got confused at some point in time
it doesn't look like what i saw was PDO after all, i just read the docs on mysqli bind_param
it has this type of notation
i'll just put it to rest
thanks again
 
8:14 AM
Good morning
Laravel issue here: using File::makeDirectory($path, 775, true, true); to create dir
however the dir is created with some crazy permission set (user read only, sticky bit)
1400
any ideas here?
 
@sitilge 0775 != 775
 
so could that be it?
just setting the first bit
?
sorry, but it seems to be weird for me...
@nikita2206 well, afaik not providing the last bit makes it 0 by default
 
@sitilge php.net/manual/en/language.types.integer.php you're not setting the first bit when you write 0775, you're using octal base for your integer this way
 
@nikita2206 yes, read an article
26
Q: Is there any difference between mode value 0777 and 777

user1071840I saw a code change at work, where the mode values were changed from 777 to 0777 to make nfs setattr work. What is the difference in the 2 values?

lesson of the day: there is a difference :)
 
8:48 AM
mornings
 
morning
i think that's not larvel problem you are setting sticky bit permission to dir
 
question ...
<?php
$shared = new Threaded();
while (@$i++ < 10) {
	$shared[] = $i;
}

$thread = new class($shared) extends Thread {

	public function __construct(Threaded $shared) {
		$this->shared = $shared;
	}

	public function run() {
		foreach ($this->shared as $key => $value) {
			printf("%d\n", $key);
		}
	}

	private $shared;
};

$thread->start();

unset($shared[5]);
unset($shared[6]);
?>
if unset() occurs when iterations is going on, would you expect an exception ?
 
java calls this ConcurrentModificationException ...
and throws because it can't carry on ... we can carry on, but it might not be what you wanted ...
 
muuuuuuuurghin
 
8:56 AM
morning
 
moin chris ... when able to read, read what I just said please ... input is useful
 
@DaveRandom o/
 
@JoeWatkins Just carry on, that's the standard PHP behavior: 3v4l.org/cviv2
 
yeah java can throw when no threads are involved, it's a dumb exception, I always hated it ...
 
Everyone hates that exception, it's even more painful than NullPointerException.
 
8:58 AM
but my misses keeps telling me not everything is about me ... and I'm trying hard to listen ...
in a way the code is wrong
 
anyone using amazon s3 ?
 
Java would throw in the code sample I just provided, regardless of threads being used or not.
 

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