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12:07 AM
I would just like to point out, that (IMO) those who petitioned (and won, of course) for HTML5 to maintain "relaxed" markup rules, should all be walked out to sea carrying bricks.
 
could one just write to the internals@php mail list?
 
Hello everyone.
Does anyone here freelance, by any chance? I'm busy expanding my company and will be taking in a bunch of new projects. My team currently consists of a great designer, an excellent front-end dev and myself. I'm just looking for someone reliable that I can build a long-term working relationship with and outsource PHP work to. Currently I just have 1 project that I need a quote on.
 
@DJSquared There are plenty of freelance-network services.
Rarely is this room treated as one.
 
Alright, thanks Dan. Just thought I'd try my luck
 
@DJSquared Most people here are either fully-employed or not at all reliable.
 
12:20 AM
:P
 
@Danack s/or/and/
 
@DJSquared btw Saturday night is not the best time to ask in here....I'd recommend late afternoon UTC during a weekday.
 
@Danack Some of them spend most of the time on youtube.
 
@Danack Thanks. I'll try again some time.
 
12:55 AM
$a=(int)M_PI;$b=2;var_dump(($a-$a%$b)/$b);
 
1:05 AM
@derp fyi I just realised, I am definitely going to have to change all the namespaces for the project....as I need to use it alongside the Satis library, which relies on the real symfony/console, so they both need to be in use at once.
 
@CSᵠ Sorry man, pi is out - tau is the new hotness.
@Danack I figured it'd happen sooner or later.
 
@derp who needs full-circles? pi ftw!
 
@bwoebi pi is okay I guess, but it's just not really all that impressive
 
@derp just like tau ;-)
 
2:01 AM
@JoeWatkins It took me longer than I thought (there were a few compile failures and segfaults I had to fix first (I couldn't test earlier before all the macros were converted, so…))
But here is it!
 
Good Morning
 
@JoeWatkins Showing 20 changed files with 2,004 additions and 1,033 deletions. Have fun reviewing it =) [fyi: there are some whitespace fixes, but most are real changes]
also, due to the fact, that I was working on a version in php-src, there are some size_t changes included which aren't yet in krakjoe/phpdbg. Just ignore them.
@JoeWatkins phpdbg -x to enable xml mode
 
 
3 hours later…
4:57 AM
@bwoebi cool beans! :D
@NikiC that's awesome! ^_^
 
5:18 AM
@FlorianMargaine I told you to use it because it would make the class reflect properly ...
I can be wrong ... I don't think I am, I don't think we want classes to reflect incorrectly, I don't think there's any point in being able to specify type info if we're just going to ignore it everywhere ...
@NikiC they get it from phpclasses :D
@bwoebi awesome stuff, will be digging in soonish
@AndreaFaulds why did you close the vote early ? you know not everyone voted yet ...
 
5:43 AM
1
A: Why do we really need apache + php if php can run as web server?

Peter HorvathApache is fast and very good configurable. For static file service, php will be sub-optimal. There is another big problem with the php, and that is that it doesn't have a working multithreaded garbage collector. It can't work even in multithreaded environment. This is the cause, why apache need ...

burn with fire ... can't ... because only just signed up ...
 
5:57 AM
0
A: Why do we really need apache + php if php can run as web server?

Joe WatkinsAs someone mentioned already, the server built into the command line interface of PHP is a development only server, it is not fully featured. It exists so that we can internally test things that require a webserver, primarily; it is useful for internals developers. It is useful for PHP programmer...

 
6:33 AM
@JoeWatkins It probably wouldn't have swung the vote enough to make a difference, but it would have been nicer to wait until the weekend was over ...
 
I hadn't voted yet, nor had a bunch of other people, and the vote was closed 6 days after being opened.
 
not just that, it's already merged
quickly, before ze Germans get 'ere.
 
yeah, don't like this at all ...
 
7:10 AM
@JoeWatkins was it you who suggested to only deprecate a certain kind of string increment? I thought it was Bob, but I couldn't find anything conclusive from the chat history.
 
don't remember details of it ...
 
dang
 
don't really remember much of last week tho ... so wouldn't remember ... probably was bob though ...
 
it wasn't from last week, longer ago.
Dec 27 '13 at 10:26, by bwoebi
@Jack no, but I'm not fine with your RFC too. At least the usual $a = "A"; $a++/--; should work, the alphanumeric mix you can remove. completely and then we don't eed str_inc/dec()
Wow, okay, that's really long ago.
Time to revive this old rfc :)
 
0
A: Looking for efficient Task Scheduler

Joe WatkinsDespite what our teachers told us, there is such a thing as a stupid question; this is the reason you didn't get a decent answer thus far. Rather than ignoring that you asked the question, on this occasion, I'll take the time to explain why the question is stupid in the hope that future readers,...

I should have answered when there was a bounty ...
 
7:52 AM
Hi everyone. Do you know any other chat room for PHP developers?
 
hi @JoeWatkins
did you see your pings?
@user3002233 maybe irc?
you did, you even answered it.
:-)
waiting for @NikiC's answer before going further then :P
 
Which method is better for sending messages to a user? with function OR including a file?
 
in which context?
 
8:14 AM
like sending some errors.
 
I like tradition, so I'd go with a letter ...
 
I can create a function for echoing it. but I also can create a file for sending it.
 
mornings
 
@JoeWatkins btw I agree with you, OBJ_ARG_INFO is definitely cleaner. I don't really understand nikita's argument tbh, but since his voice is quite important, I'd rather listen to it before doing anything :)
 
@tereško morning.
 
8:16 AM
@tereško monring
 
@FlorianMargaine yeah sure ... it sounds like a premature optimization and if it isn't premature, then it's not down to the people writing extensions (and so using arginfo) to solve it ... so we should fix it basically if it is a problem ...
 
@user3002233 your question is invalid
 
morning @tereško
 
aaaand I wanted to write a PR for this bug... but I have the same issue. Go with correct type hints or not? :-)
the thing is, with OBJ_ARG_INFO, you get real type hinting (catchable fatal error if a wrong object is passed), but only a warning if you use zpp to take care of it
I'll just see if another bug looks fun to solve :P
who's Derick btw? ext/date's maintainer?
 
@tereško really? I just wanted to ask that, should I use a function for view part in MVC or should i use a new file and include it.
 
8:18 AM
yeah @FlorianMargaine
 
or class.
 
@user3002233 echo it
@JoeWatkins and... is he hard to work with?
 
echo $response->getBody();
 
I can echo it from function, class, included file.
 
Morning all
 
8:21 AM
wow, filter_var(..., FILTER_VALIDATE_URL) seems quite broken
@Fabien
 
Supposed to be in Coventry right now supporting a friend at a body-building show but some asscactus jumped in front of a train in front of mine so now I get to spend the day at home.
Granted it's sad he/she felt the need to do it but don't make your last act on earth inconvenience thousands of others.
 
@Fabien there is obvious need for official Suicide Booths
 
lol
 
8:36 AM
just to make sure, the place to discuss php bugs/resolution is internals?
 
@tereško What if $response does not have any other method? shouldn't I use a function?
 
@JoeWatkins great… can't wait to read some feedback :-)
 
oh , but it would have. In my code the Response instance deals also with headers, cookies and status code. Then again, I don't think I will be able to explain you the architecture in terms taht you know.
 
@tereško So It's better to have a Response class instead of a "views" folder. right?
 
8:51 AM
@tereško Oh, I'm sorry. Thanks anyway.
 
what you call "views" are just dumb templates. A proper view would be an instance which is responsible for (based on data that it gets from business model) construction and logic of user interface.
I personally prefer assemble the interface in a Response instance, which the selected view acts upon
 
@tereško Do you know any resource for learning MVC? because I have read many articles and websites and books about It, but I'm not good at it.
 
OK. Cool. Thanks.
 
9:10 AM
stars ar not for making your personal bookmarks
 
@tereško Oh, that one's actually starworthy though.
 
@rdlowrey If you use the same exception for things you really should distinguish them via codes.
The messages just make it easier to understand what happened.
 
9:35 AM
nobody uses exception codes
 
@AndreaFaulds it seems you got bitten by the short voting period.
I did recommend that you lengthen it.
 
> If you have a boolean, performing increments on it won't do anything despite it being 1. This is a case where you have to use a cast.
:mindblown:
 
Oh wait, it passed.
Exactly 2/3
 
You got bitten by short thinking period.
 
@LeviMorrison It passed by-design
That is, Andrea waited until there were just enough votes, then closed it ^^
 
9:38 AM
that sure looked tricky from Andrea to close it so fast
 
@webarto I am going on 2 hours of sleep :)
But in any case, I really think people should have longer voting periods than 7 days.
 
@NikiC @JoeWatkins in the mood to talk about ext/date arguments handling? :-)
 
@LeviMorrison Just kidding :)
 
@FlorianMargaine Just ask derick about it
 
k, sending a mail to internals then?
 
9:49 AM
It's his code, so he'll know which approach he prefers
either that, or check if he's in #php.pecl
 
though probably he isn't today as it's sunday ^^
 
sent a mail to the list, we'll see
feel free to chime in
 
10:13 AM
oh we [i] don't want to do that ...
you said what I would say anyway, but derick likes to do his own thing ...
 
k
if he says no, I'll report a bug because reflection doesn't give the right types
:P
 
and it'll be marked XFAIL because "various bugs exist"
 
oh true, it's in this package... I saw them going through the ./run-tests...
 
ThW
Morning
 
morning
I was thinking about you!
I'll try to do that bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=67949
note the try
:P
 
ThW
10:23 AM
cool
 
@NikiC should be enough to change to zend_uint in bug #68057
 
@tereško you're gonna love what the article's author calls "model" reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/2gz7kd/…
 
@FlorianMargaine is that supposed to be about packaging?
i.e. classes can only be accessed from within the same namespace
 
@Leigh yup
he has a workaround... I don't get how it works though
 
I talked to NikiC about implementing that maybe a year ago - summary: not really easy without re-implementing how namespaces work
because PHP namespaces fake it
 
10:39 AM
may as well just add friend a la c++
 
@derp that sounds like a good idea
 
really? I expected to be kicked in the balls for that comment
 
10:58 AM
@FlorianMargaine some days it seems that it's completely pointless even to fight against the stupidity that was been caused by Rails
 
@tereško lol
@DaveRandom trying to implement ArrayAccess for DOMNodeList, but not sure what I should do with offsetSet and offsetUnset. Should I just leave them empty?
 
not sure, is there anything else bundled that implements it in a read-only way?
 
ThW
@FlorianMargaine I would throw exceptions
 
As would I, but it will never fly with internals
iirc SimpleXML doesn't actually implement ArrayAccess, it uses internal magic, so maybe do that, that way you have license to do whatever you like because you're not adhering to an interface
 
awesome
magic
:P
 
11:11 AM
Yeh, I know. Sorry.
You could try asking in #php.pecl
That's a good way to reach internals people without starting an actual internals thread
 
k
I should find the real efnet.org link
irc.efnet.org:6667 doesn't seem to work
 
I just use irccloud
Which has the common networks built in
 
oh, irc.efnet.info it is
@DaveRandom I have a znc... I prefer erc
 
You should check out irccloud, it's really a great product and it takes a bunch of hassle away when you switch machines a lot
 
yup, I tried it
I even had the idea before I knew about it :P github.com/Ralt/lbnc
 
11:18 AM
I will try and wrap my head around lisp again at some point, every time I try I lose patience very quickly though
 
gigamonkeys.com/book is pretty easy to read, I really like this book
you learn a ton very quickly
and it's well written.
 
tnx, bookmarked
 
11:32 AM
@DaveRandom looks like it's gonna be a mail to internals...
 
funzies :-P
dammit Wireshark is very unstable these days, it doesn't seem to cope well with direct write to disk capturing any more
The file is there, but the memory usage just keeps spiralling out of control as well
 
\o/ got rid of the foreach() {} or {} segfault
 
11:46 AM
Funny in this video at time 01:10:50 :p
 
anyone know much about ODBC connections to phpmyadmin?
 
@RahulKhosla phpmyadmin is a UI, not a dbms itself.
 
thanks for the clarification. I am having errors when connecting to the MySql database, would you be able to help me with this please?
 
@Leigh what about do while? :D
 
@FlorianMargaine deliberately excluded
 
11:55 AM
:(
 
@RahulKhosla Sorry, connecting from excel to mysql has nothing to do with PHP.
 
ok thanks anyways
 
@RahulKhosla Don't do that. Preferably don't do anything in VBA ever, but certainly don't do that. Whatever you are doing, if you need to talk to a database, Excel is the wrong tool for the job.
 
Dear.
That's cute
 
12:23 PM
mornign
 
Hi @FlorianMargaine ! I solved my RewriteRule problem from yesterday !
Would you have an idea for this : I would like that when you click on SAVE button of bigpicture.bi/toi , some data is sent to the server. I want all <span class="texte"> to be sent to the server (save.php will then save it into server)
 
@Basj grab a php form tutorial
 
@FlorianMargaine Why "form" ?
 
not necessary
but that gives you a hint
 
I used :
  var data = new FormData();
  data.append("data" , "the_text_you_want_to_save");
  var xhr = (window.XMLHttpRequest) ? new XMLHttpRequest() : new activeXObject("Microsoft.XMLHTTP");
  xhr.open( 'post', '/save.php', true );
  xhr.send(data);
Now the question is : comment faire pour envoyer à save.php the collection of all HTML inside <span contenteditable="true" class="texte"> ? (so that save.php will save all these things into server)
 
12:31 PM
English please
 
@Basj You might want the javascript room, this really doesn't have anything to do with PHP
 
yeah
and the code is really weird... dunno where you copied that from
 
@JoeWatkins "is helping people with wordpress ethically wrong ?" no, not imo.. that is why I made the uninstall plugin.. =p .. but no really I think it really depends on the context .. sometimes yes mostly no
 
@FlorianMargaine a SO answer that had lots of positive votes !
@derp I thought it had to do with PHP because PHP will then save the data
 
it's really wrong... it tries to fallback for old browsers, but shows stuff only new browsers support
@Basj show it please, I have to fix it :)
 
12:40 PM
2
Q: saving text file on server using javascript

mike doughtyis it possible to save text to a new text file using javascript/jquery without using PHP? the text i'm tying to save may contain HTML entities, js, html, css and php scripts that i don't want to escape or use urlencodeg! if it's only can be achieved using php how can i pass the text to php witho...

 
"a lot of positive votes" = 11?
 
No, 11
 
yeah, that's not a lot
 
@FlorianMargaine well, it's infinity much more than the other answer which has 0 upvotes ;)
(btw it was not my SO question)
 
@Basj But the question isn't about how to save incoming post data, it's about how to send that data in the first place.
 
12:42 PM
ohi
 
congrats on your rfc, @AndreaFaulds. that was close.
 
@derp Was thanks to @bwoebi
 
is there any resource to work with opcodes? google doesn't help much :/
like the devzone.zend.com tutorials for php exts, but for opcodes
 
@derp yes probably, I still don't know much about this that's why I came here.
@FlorianMargaine do you think this SO answer is bad ?
If so do you have a better SO answer in mind that would show the same thing with better code ?
(This SO answer had no negative comments, that's why I trusted it)
(and by the way it works!)
 
> To send raw data without URIencoding or escaping special characters to the php and save it as new txt file you can send ajax request using post method and FormData like:
do you need raw data?
 
12:52 PM
I need to send all the HTML data which is of the form : <span class=texte>...</span>
all these spans (which will be edited by the user with contenteditable=true) have to be serialized (i.e. sent to save.php)
have to go (family), will be back soon, and if oyu have a reference, you can paste here, I'll read later!
 
@Basj it uses jquery, but read this tutorial blog.teamtreehouse.com/create-ajax-contact-form
@NikiC what's the best resource you got if someone wants to dive in AST?
don't say code don't say code don't say code
if you say existing implementations as examples, I'd accept that
 
@FlorianMargaine have you looked at the code? :P
 
use Artax\Cookie\ArrayCookieJar;

class SessionCookieJar extends ArrayCookieJar {}
^ Using / extending one of @rdlowrey classes directly in a system #LiveLifeOnTheEdge
 
@Leigh yeah I looked at your code... Hence my question
 
aaaah damnit. The array is private :(
 
1:06 PM
@FlorianMargaine the AST is pretty easy to pick up, I never touched it until ~5 days ago
 
Ok
I'll try to write a tutorial like how to extend the AST, best way to learn I know :p
 
@FlorianMargaine Cunningham's law
 
Those who don't know, teach?
Too lazy to google
 
"the best way to get the right answer on the Internet is not to ask a question, it's to post the wrong answer."
 
1:19 PM
It even works to get the text of the law.
 
ugh, I just spent a good 3 hrs shouting at a box because it wouldn't do a factory reset, turns out the hdd is dead, replaced it and it worked straight away
 
@derp hahaha
@DaveRandom stop shouting at boxes, they have feelings too!
 
This particular brand of box hates me with a passion
 
mac?
 
anyway.. @DaveRandom I have your IP now... ur gunna be hacked...
192.168.0.1... here I come
 
1:31 PM
No, phone system, embedded linux box
@FlorianMargaine Yep. Just so you know you have the right computer when you are hacking, it's a Netgear that looks suspiciously like your router. But don't be fooled, you still want to fuck it up good and proper.
:-P
 
good and proper!
but I don't think my router is a neatgear
 
Man I hate Netgear these days, I had to deal with one a few days ago, they suck now
 
dunno how it works outside of France, but the main ISPs rent a "box", a rebranded router
I have no idea what my router's brand is
 
Years ago they were the best SOHO kit, really good value for money. Now they're knocked out for about 30p and they suuuuuuck
 
I've never wanted to have a custom router at home tbh :|
I struggled enough with them at work..
 
1:35 PM
@FlorianMargaine You can usually figure it out from the mac vendor. A lot of those things are either Netgear DG834 variants or linksys (usually mac vendor says cisco for these)
It's good to know what it really is because they usually leave the original vendor back doors in
 
@FlorianMargaine Get a Draytek. Cannot recommend them highly enough.
 
that reminds me of a story where a backdoor existed... if you added an http header, the router left you admin access
 
Enterprise features for (upper-end) SOHO money
 
I no longer do sysadmin work
for home... I'd need to spend time configuring it
 
1:37 PM
Me neither as a general rule, doing an little off-book job for an ex-customer though
Well, a customer of my ex employer
my only complaint about the draytek kit is that it's not scriptable, but I guess if you want that then you want a custom linux job
Then was a neat thing about the old-school DG8xx kit from netgear though, you could cross-compile for them
I had one with PHP running on it once, although it was comically slow
 
@DaveRandom Just like any router out there with a webinterface :)
 
But it was some flavour of embedded linux and it had all the build headers in the fs. No built in compiler, but all the stuff you needed to build a cross compiler
 
@DaveRandom lol
@DaveRandom bad engineers :P
 
I'm still trying to build a cross compiler for this phone system, it has no build headers though so I've been trying to cobble them together for various places around teh internets, never managed to make a workable executable yet though :-(
It runs some really weird (read: old) versions of a lot of things
 
you're weird
might as well build the header files from binary (symbols) inspection
dunno if something exists for that...
 
1:45 PM
CS5100-0007D900A5C3# cat /proc/version
Linux version 2.6.18 (v3p2@Linux Build) (gcc version 3.3.3) #9 Wed Sep 14 10:42:27 BST 2011
 
write a program for that :P
 
Check out that gcc version :-S
 
lol
let me check gcc changelog...
they're at 4.9 right now right?
 
something like that
I think I have 4.6, a while since I did anything where that mattered though, I could be wrong
4.4.7 is the yum-provided version on centos
 
iirc linux can't build on gcc 4.5+ or something because of a gcc bug
did you see the thread a couple weeks ago? it made some noise
 
1:47 PM
On gcc? No, that's a little too meta for me
 
if you got a couple minutes to spare
it was entertaining
Linus is always fun to read :)
 
He must be the worst co-worker ever
 
> Adding Jakub to the cc, because gcc-4.9.0 seems to be terminally broken
@DaveRandom dunno about that
 
I did see that actually, now I re-read it, it must have done the Twitter rounds or something
@FlorianMargaine Yeh but... in public. I mean everybody has conversations/rants like that in private but I expect better behaviour on mailing lists. PHP is bad sometimes, but never that bad
Linus is an MDFL
 
@DaveRandom It's a Norwegian thing I think - basically they don't seem to have a filter on what they say.
 
1:58 PM
@Leigh where's do {} while() or {} ?
 
Worked with a guy who was a shitty coder, but he criticised other people in the same style as Linus "Your code is ugly, so you must be ugly"
 
@Dave mdfl?
 
@bwoebi ignored on purpose
 
@Danack note that Linus criticizes code, not people
 

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