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6:12 PM
hi all
whats up?
@rlc: hi
@nils,@rlc: did you ever use compass gradient operator?
 
@jweyrich mistype?
 
rlc
@Xaade I think he just mistook the future for the past ;-)
 
no such SE as bughouse... yet
 
@Xaade no, it was indeed to you.
 
in which case morethanoneme.stackexchange.com would be a better one to try
But it wouldn't fit into the Stack Exchange program.
Stack Exchange is a Q&A site, not an A&Q site.
The point of an A&Q site is to answer an arbitrary question with information, then everyone posts questions that qualify as being answered by the OP. Such a site would require the searching of questions. Does SE support searching "answers".
In this manner, we eliminate redundant questions.
 
6:40 PM
A: Yes. Q: Is this the correct question?
 
sbi
6:56 PM
Someone made the c++11 tag a synonym of the c++0x tag: stackoverflow.com/tags/c%2b%2b0x/synonyms. IMO calling this "wrong" would be a serious understatement. As someone else (@jalf?) said: That's as if we'd still refer to Vista as "Longhorn". (Please star this if you agree with me that this is wrong.)
11
 
Xeo
@sbi Wait, again?
 
@MartinhoFernandes You got the idea!
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: C++0x != C++11
 
sbi
@Xaade Great idea!
 
@sbi Brain control.
 
sbi
@Xaade What? (I didn't know you are a room owner.)
 
7:05 PM
Only by proxy..... proxy by brain control!!!
You're saying everything I say....
Yes, but I'm saying it first....
Are you???
 
sbi
@Xeo What do you want me to repeat? It seems like @Jerry proposed it and it got enough upvotes to be rushed through behind our backs. But it's plain wrong. I was thinking about posting a question to meta, but I first wanted to get an impression of the room's opinion on the matter.
@Xaade You should smoke less of that stuff. Really. Much less.
 
@sbi If this were true, then we'd have to keep changing the synonyms everytime C++0x were pushed back yet another year.
@sbi [Dinner for Shmucks] reference
Sorry if you didn't get it.
 
sbi
@Xaade You got this wrong. <sigh/> (It's not you. The matter is confusing.) Now c++11 is a synonym of c++0x, which means that whenever someone tags a question c++11, it will automagically be retagged c++0x. That is stupid.
 
Xeo
@Xaade 'C++0x != C++11 == Syntax error' :)
 
@sbi I don't have to smoke anything. When I was 16 I had my first annual physical checkup. At which point the doctor discovered that my brain naturally produced enzymes that acted as toxicants.
 
7:09 PM
Yes, I proposed it. I don't see the relevance of Windows versions either. I see a couple of points to tag synonyms, and both seem to fit in this case. First, that somebody who's interested in ("following") C++0x as a tag would also see questions tagged c++11. It's a bit hard to imagine somebody following one, but not caring about the other.
 
sbi
@Xaade I actually had to look this one up.
 
The second point is to let searches for one find the other. Again, this seems (to me) to make sense.
 
sbi
@JerryCoffin The problem is that with this, every question tagged c++11 will automagically be retagged c++0x. Sorry, but that's bovine excrements. We don't want to be calling this "C++0x" five years from now (just as we don't call Vista "Longhorn" anymore).
 
@sbi Right.... so when C++0x is pushed back another year and they change the synonym, all those questions tagged C++11 will lose that data, and people will see the questions as referring to C++0x, which they'll assume also means C++12. At which point meta-data about the question is lost.
 
sbi
@Xaade I still maintain that you should smoke less. Why would the tags magically change when the year changes?
 
rlc
7:13 PM
@sbi I guess @Xaade, like me, isn't convinced the final standard will come out this year
 
@sbi They won't.... I'm saying that IF WHEN C++0x isn't finished in 2011, and is pushed back to 2012, someone MIGHT change the C++0x synonym to C++12, and remove the C++11 synonym.
 
rlc
in any case, the current synonym points the wrong way around, and IMO shouldn't be there at all - at least not yet
 
If that happened, anyone referring to C++11, will lose that meta-data.
 
sbi
@rlc That might be a valid argument against making c++0x a synonym of c++11. But this is now the other way around!
@Xaade See my reply to @rlc. It seems you still haven't understood the direction this synonyming was done.
 
rlc
@sbi yes, as I said:
@rlc here
 
7:17 PM
@sbi Of so, then yes, I screwed up. I thought I'd done the opposite, so existing C++0x tags would be "converted" treated as "C++11", not vice versa.
 
@sbi Goes both ways @sbi. Suppose someone tags C++11, and C++0x gets reused to mean something else.
Honestly..... questions tagged C++0x should refer to the unfinished standard.... and never refer to the finished standard.
Anything that is tagged C++0x referring to a finished standard should be retagged C++11 if it comes out this year.
The C++0x tag is only meaningful (once the standard comes out) if it refers to the standard as uncompleted.
 
@Xaade I initially approved of C++11 becoming the master, but now I'm leaning towards this.
 
sbi
@Xaade One more (and last) time: This is another discussion, which we had here recently, and in which i was convinced to not (yet) make c++0x a synonym of c++11. The problem is that it is now the other way around. (Synonyms are uni-directional.)
 
Actually, I don't care anymore if C+11 becomes the master or not. But I do care about the opposite.
 
rlc
@Xaade I heartily agree :-)
 
7:19 PM
For example, what if someone has a valid question about an issue in the unfinished standard. C++11 would imply the standard as finished at which point their question may not be valid, or even make sense. Then it will get downvoted unnecessarily.
 
rlc
where's the question on meta again..?
 
It's pinned.
Was.
 
rlc
11
Q: Should the [c++11] tag be synonymous with the [c++0x] tag?

In silicoAs far as I know, the tags c++0x (1,048 questions) and c++11 (8 questions) on Stack Overflow refer to the newly finalized C++ standard that is expected to be published in summer 2011. Should c++0x be the "real" tag and c++11 be a tag synonym, considering the question count and the fact that it'...

 
lol
-3
A: C++ "expected primary-expression before ‘(’ token" error

Neil ButterworthThis is cr*p: throw LangException(builtin_classes::exception_class::create_ImportError(String::fromAscii(e.filename)-> append(String::fromAscii(":"))-> ...

i keep using "C++0x"
until C++11 is officially released
 
sbi
@rlc I haven't posted any yet. @all: Feel free to do so.
 
7:21 PM
Which begs the question. Why does the C++11 tag exist?
 
rlc
I'd think this is still the same question?
 
There may never be a C++11 standard.
 
@JohannesSchaublitb Neil went way over the top there.
But he has a point.
 
i would like someone to stop the C++11 from happening. it's too bugged, and a lot of knowledgable ppl agree with me
so that finally i can call it C++13
 
sbi
@JohannesSchaublitb Good luck. That's a freight train at full speed. We'll miss you.
 
7:24 PM
And concepts :)
 
@JohannesSchaublitb any thoughts on my comment?
 
I think that C++11 has a minor fail in some areas
like lambdas not defining equality is a mistake
but that's what DR's are for
 
@DeadMG Damage Reduction?
 
Defect Report
I also think that C++11 could go further to make function objects easier to use
for example, there's no reason that object.function should not yield a function object, with operator() that will call said function upon said object
much like can be done in .NET
 
What about overloads?
 
7:28 PM
I feel that a lambda is a little redundant when you'd just be doing [](...) { object.func(...); }
 
In .NET you have to fallback to good old lambdas.
 
then the result has an overloaded operator()
in .NET you can do event += object.func;
and I see no reason that C++11 shouldn't support such simplicity either, it's not like a JIT or GC
 
C# != .NET.
 
really? I was pretty sure that it was for all .NET languages
oh well, I still see no reason why C++11 shouldn't offer it
 
Nope. Being able to use a method name as a delegate is a syntactic thingy.
 
7:31 PM
which is exactly why there's no reason C++ shouldn't offer it
it's not like we use that syntax for something else, and the transformation is relatively trivial
 
I'm missing constexpr lambdas
 
more important, I think, would be defining lambdas to allow for equality
 
[](int n) constexpr { return n > 10; }
 
if (captured variables) define equality, and are equal, then lambda is equal, else not equal, else doesn't define equality
then you could have std::function<> define it too, which would be nice
 
I'd consider only identical lambdas to be equal.
 
7:36 PM
that's pretty much what I said
 
rlc
yes: lambdas that come from the same expression and have the same values in their captured variables
 
after all, since each lambda is a unique type, then you can't even compare them unless they originated from the same expression
then, the containing std::function would easily compare not equal, as the types contained within would be not equal
a task which is easily done by means of typeid() or dynamic_cast
 
@DeadMG lambda = emulated inline.... which means you get to type it inline. I like that.
 
@Xaade: Of this I am definitely aware.
 
Then why create a situation where you need to know if lamdas are equal.
 
7:41 PM
it's called multicast delegates
 
If you need equality, then use a function object. If you need to reuse, then do a callback. If you don't need either, then use a lambda.
 
apparently, multicast delegates are a desirable thing, and they need operator== for std::function
which would therefore require operator== to be defined for lambda expressions for it to have any real meaning
 
@DeadMG You see... that's where I see it as using the wrong tool for the job.
 
since I didn't specify a job, how can you assume that multicast delegates are not up to it?
 
It's so simpler to just create a functor anyway, if you need all that overriding.
@DeadMG lamda, not md.
I'm saying, it's a case of you wanting lamda to do things that it doesn't have to do.
Because functors would do it better.
 
7:43 PM
how on earth would they do it better?
specifying equivalence for lambdas would be trivial
 
What if you want to do more than just override ==
 
lambdas are functors, just defined inline in a nice handy package, and they should be able to do nearly everything that functors can do
 
.NET has multicast delegates, without any checks for delegate equality.
 
then that's a different problem
 
.NET uses referential equality only.
 
7:45 PM
That's what I'm saying.... when I want to use a lamda, I don't really care if it can specify equivalence, because I look at it as a one time use inline.
 
not helpful in a value-typed language
@Xaade: Lambdas are inline, not one-time use
 
@DeadMG You can type them at the point of use though.
 
not really
 
for_each(.... { total += x.value }
 
what if I pass a lambda, and it gets put into a std::function, which is moved into some arbitrary object on the heap, stuck in a vector, and a billion other being moved around in a completely implementation-defined way, and then being called?
 
7:47 PM
multicast_delegate d;
for(int i=0; i < 10; i++)
    d += [](){blah};
You only need equality for removal.
 
std::vector<int> some_list;
int total = 0;
std::for_each(some_list.begin(), some_list.end(), [&total](int x) {
total += x;
});
typed at point of use.
 
@Martinho: Removal is pretty important
 
there's no meaningful/intuitive definition of equivalence for a lambda function though. And exposing the underlying functor's equality seems an odd way to break the abstraction
 
@Xaade: Yeah, I know what inline means. I know how to use a lambda. My point is that inline is totally not equal to one-time use
 
And how would removal work in that example?
Better, put a different lambda at index 5.
 
7:48 PM
@DeadMG I KNOW... I'm saying the only time I'd use a lamda is if I want to type it at the point of use, which would have it be inline one-time use.
 
@jalf: Seems pretty intuitive to suggest that lambdas are equal if their captures are equal
 
Now how do you remove the 6th [](){blah} ?
 
@Xaade: Then you're doing it wrong
 
@DeadMG: Really? But if I declare two identical lambdas, are they equal?
 
@Xaade: typing it at the point of use is NOT THE SAME as inline one-time use
 
7:49 PM
How so? Isn't that code up there easier than specifying a callback.
 
@jalf In .NET they aren't.
 
@jalf: The type system already takes care of that- two different lambda expressions don't have the same type
which pretty inherently makes them uncomparable
 
@DeadMG How is it different?
 
@DeadMG and thus your equivalence breaks down. Logically, they should be just as equal as two instances of the same lambda with the same capture
 
@Xaade: As I said, because you could just make a simple std::function to hold the lambda and then pass that std::function around however you like, and then call it six hundred times in a completely different place
 
7:50 PM
it becomes inconsistent and unintuitive and error-prone
 
@Xaade How can I reuse that lambda?
 
and whatever .NET's designers were smoking when they allowed it ought to be outlawed
 
@DeadMG But I didn't.... I typed it right there.
 
@jalf It's not. All instances are different in .NET.
 
@Xaade: So what? Just because in that specific case, it's not re-used doesn't mean that it's not perfectly within the lambda use case to be re-usable
 
7:51 PM
DeadMG wants different instances to compare equal.
 
@DeadMG if you want a functor, define a functor. A lambda is supposed to represent a lambda function. The fact that it uses a functor under the hood is an implementation detail, and that shouldn't leak out into the abstraction of a lambda function
 
@jalf: We already have that problem, since they don't share the same type
 
@DeadMG I'm not saying lambda use case isn't reusable. I'm saying most of the time I wouldn't reuse them. I don't really loop through an array more than once and reuse the same logic. If I'm going to do that, I'm going to call a function that wraps around it, because a lambda by itself doesn't do enough to bother reusing.
All of that.... is IMO....
 
@DeadMG Why is it a problem that they don't share the same type?
 
@jalf: Well, you just said that logically, they should be just as equal as two instances of the same lambda
 
7:53 PM
Because
int i = 5;
double j = 5;

if (i == j) implicitly converts to if (i == (int)j), which isn't the same thing. Something you can't do for lambdas.
 
but they're not, because they're different types
 
@DeadMG yes. In other words equality should be defined in both cases, or in none of them
that's what "just as" means. The same.
 
auto x = [](){};
x = [](){}; // Oh noes! They should be equal, but instead, the compiler throws.
 
@DeadMG they should be equal if and only if x==x
either you can compare lambdas in the general case, or it doesn't make sense to compare lambdas whether they use the same functor under the hood or not
anyway, sleepytime
 
@Xaade: How about the simple case of a callback, like say, a button click? Gosh, now you might want to call the lambda every time the button's clicked, and store it in some object somewhere!
 
7:57 PM
@DeadMG At that point, I just use C#.... C++ isn't convenient for GUI.
 
it can work if you have a decent library for it
although I have to admit, those can be hard to come by
 
@DeadMG So does MFC.
 
a button click is just one example
what if I'm running a simulation and want to call back every time a certain condition occurs?
 
Hell, I could compile XML into a GUI scripting language. With MFC as a engine.
 
or in response to user input?
 
7:58 PM
Use a proper callback.
 
A lambda is supposed to represent an anonymous function. That anonymity kinda gets tossed out the window if you start distinguishing between "a lambda built on this functor" and "a lambda which does the exact same thing ,but is built on that functor"
C++'s type system doesn't allow us to completely disregard the type of a lambda, unfortunately, but that's no reason to smash even more holes into the abstraction
 
@Xaade: So because the object's lifetime is longer, I should have to not declare the code inline?
that's completely illogical
 
I always anticipated lambda as a quick replacement for an unnecessary callback you'll only use once.
 
@jalf: Personally, I don't see that much reason why identical lambdas should not be folded into the same type, although I haven't thought about it that much
 
8:00 PM
For me, this makes sense:
>>> a = lambda: None
>>> b = lambda: None
>>> a == a
True
>>> a == b
False
 
@Xaade: The purpose of lambdas is to be defined inline and easily, which is an incredible boost to programmer productivity. The lifetime of the lambda is irrelevant to this benefit.
 
That's like saying....
function pointer p = pointer of method int GetInt(int&)
function pointer m = pointer of method int GetDouble(int&)
p == m // TRUE
 
you know
on second thoughts, I'm not completely sure why I would care, since I don't have any use case for multicast delegates anyway
 
@DeadMG How is it any differently from callback with respect to productivity if you don't type it at point of use. At that point you're simply inlining a method. That doesn't increase programmer productivity, that saves on the call stack.
 
@Xaade: Typing it at the point of use is defining it inline. That's not the same as code inlining
 
8:04 PM
You're only passing an object from scope of the method at use point into the lambda's scope. Which if it is inline, would get all the surrounding references anyway.
 
however, typing it at the point of use is also completely irrelevant to it's lifetime.
 
Actually.... I kinda don't understand why you have to do that.... if you type it at point of use.

It makes more sense if you're going to reuse it.
 
well it's pretty simple
 
I suppose you're right, that the intended use is to allow programmers to inline a callback.
I just like it because I don't have to write a callback, which obfuscates code.
 
MySimulation.OnCollisionDetected = [this](...) { this->OnCollisionDetected(...); };
but writing a full functor for that would be, well, obnoxious
and a waste
even though the lifetime of the lambda is the lifetime of the simulation
 
8:06 PM
You're saying it's more productive than a functor. I'm saying it's not more productive than a callback.
 
what exactly did you have in mind for a callback apart from a lambda or functor?
 
A callback doesn't have to be associated with an object.
It can be an external function at the same namespace level, or even somewhere else.
 
I wondered, can you pass a lambda to a function where the arg is a function pointer?
 
@TonyTheTiger: Only if it's stateless
@Xaade: Those aren't stateful, which is an extremely major failing
 
8:08 PM
so it can take no args or use environment variables
 
@DeadMG STATIC VARIABLES!!!!!
 
so [](...)
 
which are extremely bad and should never be used
especially where a trivial lambda would remove the need
@Tony: Yeah, like that.
 
ok thx
 
The conversion from lambda to a pointer doesn't work on current MSVC AFAIR.
 
8:09 PM
also, you'd have to define that function out of line, which is definitely less productive than a lambda's inline
no, indeed it does not
GCC does support it, if I recall
 
um... no.... yes.... I use them to prevent endless recalling.

OnUpdate()
{
if (windowtext.length() > 10)
{
windowtext = windowtext.left
}
...
SetWindowText(windowtext);
...
}

loops endlessly, unless you add a static variable that counts use.
 
uh
member function?
 
@DeadMG updating window text sends onupdate window message.
 
Yep GCC supports it.
 
put a simple static bool around it to ensure you don't call on update during update.
 
8:12 PM
@Xaade: Windows provides for an arbitrary pointer argument, which is this
store boolean in object
 
@DeadMG and? Either way you need a static reference.
 
or, hell, just store a pointer to said boolean, or make it NULL/non-NULL
 
Where would you put the pointer.
 
@Xaade: No you don't, you can just set the pointer associated with the HWND, because the Windows message pump provides said HWND
it might be a horrific old C interface, but it's not that bad
 
@DeadMG how do you reference it though, in the same method, without referencing a different one?
 
8:15 PM
you don't need to
I'll put up some code on Pastebin
 
What if you need more than one?
 
more than one what?
 
user ptr?
 
you can set user ptr to whatever you want
so if you need more than one, just make it point to a struct with more than one ptr in it
 
so use a struct if you need to check more than one variable.
 
8:20 PM
you could just put them inside the Window class
 
I suppose.
It could be a member of the class.... but my class is full of members, and I don't want another flag that's used in only one method, when a static does the same thing.
 
well, if it's just for that one use, then set GWLP_USERDATA to NULL if not updating and this if updating
infact, you could go up to 32 bit-flags stored in there
 
I am not sure I understand the problem that you are trying to solve... anyone cares to explain in layman terms?
 
this is just for the super-genericness, like if you want to start calling virtual functions
 
I have a control window message that invokes the same message, but I don't want an endless loop, so I have a static bool that tells me if it's already been called.
DeadMG says static variables are the devil, and is trying to find alternatives.
 
8:24 PM
by "trying to find", you mean, that's the intended way of doing it
and static variables are indeed the devil
 
void func() {
static bool in = false;
if ( in ) return;
in = true;
// ... rest of the code
}
 
what if I want more than one instance of your class? or threading?
suddenly you're kind of screwed
more than kind of
 
@DeadMG the static variable is the same for every instance?
 
yes
 
8:25 PM
It's a method static variable.... not a class static.
 
how is this related to the lambdas (or is it unrelated)
 
there is only one copy of the static variable
no matter where you put it
that means that if you make multiple instances of the class, and invoke the member methods concurrently, then your code dies a horrific death
 
Hmm... the only way I see that being a problem is if one control invokes the same message on another control somehow.
 
even if the class's operations are thread-safe
hell, you could even put the bool on the local stack and put a pointer to it in GWLP_USERDATA, and check for null/non-null
 
I guess the reason I don't have a problem is because the user isn't quick enough!!!
 
8:28 PM
static variables are just a band-aid and don't solve the real problems, and create plenty of their own
 
Unless you intend for there to be ONLY one.
 
Singleton: the windowing edition.
 
after all, what if you did decide that one control should invoke that message on another control? Or if the code's maintainers in five years decided that it would be necessary given that your code has a completely new purpose from what you wrote it for?
intend != always will be
just because in the current state, there should only be one, most definitely does not make it a smart idea to enforce or depend on there only being one
 
Using GWLP_USERDATA to store this is a common idiom.
 
Hmm.... well that's universal.... when you refactor, you have to be aware of what you're refactoring....

But I see your point.
@CatPlusPlus What happens if I want separate variables in GWLP_USERDATA for different messages.... surely I wouldn't want to have one struct to store all these different purposed variables?
Don't want my update anti-loop checker to be in the same place as the windowpaint's anti-loop checker.
 
8:32 PM
the fact that you have these loops in the first place should alarm you
 
It does alarm me.
 
@Xaade What do you mean? Usually it's a class that represents a window, and you can go from there, e.g. make use of signals and slots.
 
Ok....
 
however
 
This is a long story, but I'll keep it short.
 
8:32 PM
in the Window class, you can have whatever you want
and if you have a bunch of anti-loop checkers
then store them in bit flags
or an associative container like a std::set
they don't have to be all hardcoded individual bools
 
I have an edit box, that expands as you type in it. The only way I found this could work is if you set the editbox to autoHScroll, and before it paints (on the onupdate message), control the text size by cropping the text, and then setting the select to 0,0, then back to the previous value.
However, if I set windowtext inside the onupdate, it calls onupdate again.
 
expands as you type in it?
 
Since I know I've set the window text already if it calls as a result of being called, I only want to do this once, so I have a static variable that checks for the second call and returns.
 
who came up with that? it's scrolling as you type in it, but it doesn't scale
although, admittedly, I don't see why this idea should cause the problem at hand
 
mine isn't supposed to scroll.... it scales. If I turn scrolling off, windows prevents any text from typing as it won't expand because the new letter typed isn't allowed.
If I allow autoHScroll, then it scrolls after the user types, then expands....
 
8:36 PM
you know, my WinAPI is a little rusty, but isn't there a SetWindowSize function?
 
However, if at the onupdate message, I set the selection to 0,0, then restore the selection, it will not scroll AND allow more characters, thus expanding as they type.
@DeadMG There is, but windows limits text to the size of the window.
I have allow the typed character before it expands.
 
then you need to expand the size before the last character is typed
 
It looks weird if I have this big whitespace after the text.
 
you could turn the font size all the way down
or, I mean, one character should do the trick, one space isn't a big space
 
I just wish windows had an option to allow additional characters without allowing scrolling.
 
8:42 PM
yeah
 
They didn't anticipate this at all eh?
 
I mean, I can't personally see why you'd ever want expanding over scrolling
but that's just me
 
Well, editing an address such that the address prints appropriately, but the fields are in separate edit controls.
 
here
you could just set the WindowProc to DefWindowProc when calling SetWindowText
 
DefWindowProc?
I'm using MFC.
 
8:45 PM
DefWindowProc is part of the WinAPI
 
Yeah, but MFC interferes with messages.
 
if you're using MFC, I thought they provided nice, neat OO controls for all of these things, and you didn't need Windows messages to work with it
 
um... they provide message maps.
Which setup function pointers
 
lol
well
 
It's like virtual override, but without the virtual table.
 
8:46 PM
you can use SetWindowLong to remove that functionality, briefly
 
I have bigger problems right now though
 
fair enough
 
Like, why when you call GetWindowText and the window has a null hwnd, do you get an invalid parameter error. Apparently it's because the GetWindowText fails, thus sending a length of -1 to the method that creates the string GetWindowText passes back.
Then the memory creation for the string fails because it gets a length of -1 and asserts.
Good ole windows error handling.
 
fail :P
honestly, rather than use WinAPI, I'm writing my own based on DirectX
 
Of course now that I know, I can check for hwnd before performing that call.
Oh trust me, I have knowledge of WinAPI, which ironically comes from learning pInvoke to do WinAPI in C#.
 
8:49 PM
lol
 
Didn't learn that at all while in C++.
 
.NET doesn't provide all the functionality that WinAPI does
but it does provide most of it, and the GUI libraries there are pretty good
 
Matter of fact, for as long as I've coded in C++, I know so little about it.
 
I'd use WPF, but it's interoperation with D3D is questionable
 
Um. PInvoke allows you to create messages and call win32 directly.
 
8:51 PM
yeah
I know that
just don't see why you'd want to
 
Oh, you're saying pinvoke doesn't supply all the winapi.
 
no
 
You have to.... for certain things....
 
I'm saying that most of the WinAPI already has direct .NET corresponding classes in the BCL
 
Like.... messing with other processes.
 
8:51 PM
and more provided through MS-specific libs like GUI libs
 
Of which I know nothing about.... cough
 
there's a System.Diagnostics.Process class
 
No No.... worse than that.
 
never investigated it too closely though
 
I'm sending custom messages to another process by acquiring it's hwnd.
But I seriously know nothing about intercepting keystrokes from another application.
 
8:53 PM
there's Window hooks for that
 
I'm joking.
 
lol
 
I actually coded a program that basically read all the windows, figured out their hwnds, and implemented a custom windows taskbar.
the point was to allow me to categorize and create mini taskbars so I could group tasks by use instead of by exe.
Kinda like firefox tab groups.
Some of the things I did required using pinvoke.
So I just did it all in pinvoke, to practice.
C# made the GUI a lot easier, and I simply wrapped the pinvoke into a class.
Wait.... why would getwindowtext fail because of a lack of an hwnd on the ctlcolor message..... why is it trying to paint before it has an hwnd?
 
no idea
 

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