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12:00 AM
I've picked a 4-slot motherboard and I've upgraded my RAM twice by adding more modules (also the limit was 32GB)
 
@QPaysTaxes Cool. I'd hope so these days (not laptops, then, I'll assume)
 
If I was buying a motherboard today, I'd choose one with 4 slots and 64GB limit or more
 
Weirdly, I'm doing the reverse o.O
I'm ssh-ing into my company laptop. Because full-disk encryption and VPN
@QPaysTaxes Tandem machines sold that
Tandem Computers, Inc. was the dominant manufacturer of fault-tolerant computer systems for ATM networks, banks, stock exchanges, telephone switching centers, and other similar commercial transaction processing applications requiring maximum uptime and zero data loss. The company was founded in 1974 in Cupertino, California. It remained independent until 1997, when it became a server division within Compaq. It is now a server division within Hewlett Packard Enterprise, following Hewlett Packard's acquisition of Compaq and the split of Hewlett Packard into HP Inc. and Hewlett Packard Enterprise...
 
@QPaysTaxes Your Windows probably would like to be reactivated due to hardware change
 
@QPaysTaxes Like I said, I've dealt with larger systems too. Actually two clients that were running on tandem hardware
 
12:03 AM
@QPaysTaxes depends on your license and version
 
Well, the IBM mainframes will automatically phone tech support if the results of a mirrored operation disagrees. I believe the machine will also shut down, though.
 
Microsoft's licensing is quite complex
 
I'm not sure how it works on the hardware level. It just (promises) to :)
I'm not sure the practice still exists. We have software layerredundancy for almost everything these days (power supply being the main exception)
 
@milleniumbug <?= ... ?> FTW
Yes
In fact I'm p sure it would be an error
 
@QPaysTaxes Me neither. I can just attest that the PSU I have does afford 10minutes with everything and about 20 minutes just the server headless
Could be aging now. Not tested in a while
I'm heading off to bed. Unable to fix the build server. I'll have a chat with our CI guy tomorrow :)
For inspiration: pbs.org/newshour/bb/…
 
12:14 AM
@QPaysTaxes PSUs are a big deal. Don't get the cheapest one, and get only from trusted producers.
 
Mine is very similar to this one
 
Hmmm, I usually search for hardware fora to provide me with that info. Definitely not tracer and similar
 
I read somewhere on a few forums actually that some newer PSU's are incompatible some PSUs, something about pure sinewaves? eh i dont remember. But its the reason I havent bought one yet, dont want to get it wrong =/
 
<3
how are you this evening?
Soul continuing to marinate?
awh, I'm sorry to hear that
ah
yeah I can see that happening
 
@Mikhail What? 8 GB of DDR4 should be around $30-40. Maybe $50 if you decide you need really fast RAM, but certainly even close to $200. For $200 (US) you can pretty easily get 32 GB.
 
12:25 AM
@QPaysTaxes hmmm, are we talking about PSUs or UPSes now because now I'm confused
 
Coliru is a wondrous thing /cc @StackedCrooked
it actually is what runs the examples on cppreference
 
@Borgleader *newer PSU's are incompatible some UPSs
But I want one because we get more power outtages than I'm comfortable with
 
12:46 AM
Not always
 
Depends
 
initializer_list is a broken feature
 
Boring things
 
Then give carefully selected room owner the power to handle flags? All I am hearing is that 'we only trust moderators, all other room owners are untrustworthy scumbag who must not be trusted to handle flags.' This all come down to a question of trust. It's understandable that humans have fears for things that they do not understand, but most great things come out of breaking this fear. — Telkitty 8 hours ago
Going a step further, it's also about how well users are trusted. What you are suggesting is almost saying, you @Cerbrus, me are cyber criminals who have tendency to break various rules on this site, and room owners are corrupted, incompetent fools who can't handle the situations. So we should not trust that any room can function normally without inference of a moderator because useless room owners can not handle our criminal intends. I feel very insulted by this thought. — Telkitty 8 hours ago
 
12:52 AM
It's best if you don't use it
 
1:03 AM
@QPaysTaxes it’s a very poor array_view doing a tuple’s job
a view into an array
you’re welcome
put simply, a pair of iterators into an array (aka array slice)
what makes it a poor view is that it’s a read-only view and the backing array lives in a very restrictive scope (which makes the whole business error-prone)
I’m deliberately using language-agnostic terms, don’t worry
 
@LucDanton Also, arent the constructor picking rules heavily skewed in favor of the one take an initializer_list which makes overloading annoying?
 
@QPaysTaxes everybody gotta start somewhere
that one is arguable since you can claim that std::initializer_list is consistent with the rest of the language such that some_function({ 1, 2, 3 }) is no more dangerous than some_function(not_an_initializer_list(1, 2, 3))
otoh you know a beginner is going to write return { 1, 2, 3 }; in an attempt to return an std::initializer_list and then you’ll have to explain why and how that won’t work and also why the compiler wouldn’t warn him
my mistake, the compiler does warn!
@QPaysTaxes the array is never copied and leaves in the inner scope
this program is incorrect, but the compiler is of no help pointing it out to you. worse, the program appears to work
@QPaysTaxes ya got it
 
1:20 AM
its UB, in both cases yes
 
@QPaysTaxes that program fragment is not incorrect, as best as I can tell
I don’t follow, since I’m using ints
then no, it’s not exactly like a null-termination bug
easiest example is int* p; { int i = 42; p = &i; } return *p;
which attempts to use an object that’s long dead
 
^ I assumed you were returning the array
 
so’s my example, except that the root of the UB is the same
 
Theyre unrelated classes :P
 
@QPaysTaxes a vector<Super> will never contain a Sub object to begin with
since Super is abstract, something’s down the line will not work and complain loudly
@QPaysTaxes doesn’t make a difference
you can’t have a variable Super casual_variable;
 
1:31 AM
^
 
by extension, you can’t have an array of Super casual_array[] = { … can’t put anything here anyway … };
and similarly for std::vector<Super>
mixing subclass polymorphism and containers is a tricky(ish) topic no matter the language, you could start with an std::vector<std::unique_ptr<Super>> though
good catch
yes and no
a raw pointer can be used for many jobs
one of those jobs is holding a dynamically allocated object, to be released later
std::unique_ptr does take care of and refactor that last job
check out std::make_unique, it’s an important companion function
@QPaysTaxes yes
a word you’ll often see in this context is 'ownership'
exactly one instance of a unique pointer is in charge of deallocating the allocated value, hence the name
yes
you can also use *thing to get access to the pointee as a reference, same as *thing.get()
indeed
you could, but it wouldn’t be sane. it forces you to write unique_ptr<int> b(&a); (no equals sign) precisely because you have to be careful about those things
no, that doesn’t help (and prevents you from taking the address)
are we still talking about int a = 12;? read above
oh my bad
the insane part is that a is in no need of being deallocated ever, so it doesn’t make sense to hold a pointer to it inside an std::unique_ptr<int>
 
1:49 AM
Hi luc!!
 
same difference, what makes a not being sanely deallocatable is that it’s a local or global variable
you put pointers to dynamically allocated objects inside an std::unique_ptr<T>
 
Are there any good resources for learning C++ if you are familiar with C ?
heap is slow
@QPaysTaxes um... C isn't that bad
I searched it up... can't find that title
who is the author?
oh :)
know any real resources?
@QPaysTaxes cool
is it, "The C++ programming language" ?
cause that one is super confusing - no where near as good as the K&R book
 
4265
Q: The Definitive C++ Book Guide and List

grepsedawkThis question attempts to collect the few pearls among the dozens of bad C++ books that are published every year. Unlike many other programming languages, which are often picked up on the go from tutorials found on the Internet, few are able to quickly pick up C++ without studying a well-written...

 
ah okay
Why Rust?
 
because it’s neither C nor C++
 
1:57 AM
lol
probably related somehow
 
D is trying pretty hard too.
 
2:13 AM
ja
 
that’s not decided yet
err the latest C++ is C++14
Concepts-Lite had not been formulated at that time
you’ve got the timeline confused
there was nothing up for consideration for C++14
sure, but it wasn’t a matter of 'not getting put in'
 
2:35 AM
C++10 is best
 
@QPaysTaxes C++ in a Nutshell was decent, but hasn't been updated for C++11 or newer.
 
@thepiercingarrow But 10++C is faster
 
2:52 AM
Hmm
Why would /(?:^|[^\\])(?:\\\\)*\;/ only match " [*] ab" in " [*] abc; [] def; [ *] ghi; [ ] lm"?
As opposed to " [*] abc"
 
3:05 AM
@Mikhail lol
@Shoe is that perl?
 
hi everyone
 
hi @JAB
 
does anyone currently know anything about GPU coding with C++? Specifically hash generation. No its not a bitcoin miner lol which is why I cant seem to find any good reading on the topic because its all about bitcoins...
 
lol
there information about password hashing...
 
@thepiercingarrow yeah CPU code for hashing passwords and files sure. CPU is way too slow for my needs. Thats when all I get is bitcoin generators or brute forcers
 
3:10 AM
@JABFreeware lolz
 
Im generally pretty good at finding stuff...
obviously not this time
spent the last 2 hours looking and learn everything except what I need to know lol...
 
is offtopic conversation okay?
@JABFreeware what are you specifically looking for?
 
@thepiercingarrow I want to generate a lot of hashes fast but not random like stealing miner code would yield. A starting point would be a list of words and hash them all and output the hashed result of each word.
 
@JABFreeware So why don't you just do that?
@JABFreeware or hash the digits of PI :P
 
@thepiercingarrow regex
 
3:15 AM
@Shoe regex?
 
@thepiercingarrow I did in CPU code but its too slow. I don't know anything about GPU programming though and thought I could learn by modifying existing code but I cant find it thats why lol
I wish I could just do GPU.Process() lol :P
 
@JABFreeware Using a GPU for this has a serious problem (as a rule): it's likely to be I/O bound, and a GPU has slower I/O than a CPU.
 
sorry, I don't know too much about that
 
@JerryCoffin I was going to load the plaintext list into memory first of course. Process, then output the results in the end. So no IO during actual processing
 
@JABFreeware Just getting it from main memory into the GPU's memory (and back) counts as I/O in this case.
 
3:18 AM
@JerryCoffin I cant store an array in GPU memory?
I guess it doesnt work like that?
 
@JABFreeware Sure you can--but at least as things normally go, you have to read your raw data from disk into the CPU's memory. Then you copy it from the CPU's memory across the PCIe bus to get it into the GPU's memory. Then the GPU does its hashing, and deposits the result back in its own memory. Then you copy it back from GPU memory to CPU memory, and finally write the result back out to disk.
 
@JerryCoffin thats the flow I was thinking.
 
Now, if you're dealing with something where you're doing password stretching, by doing (say) 1024 iterations of hashing on each password, then you'll probably save enough by doing the processing on the GPU to make up for the added overhead of copying to and from GPU memory. If, however, you're only doing a single hash of each password, the extra I/O will probably cost more than you save on processing.
 
@JerryCoffin Well like GPU bruteforcers dont they load the whole wordlist in memory and work from that to prevent the IO cost?
 
mcafee is no longer accepting http connections?
and his https redirects to bealibertarian.com...
 
3:25 AM
@JABFreeware That doesn't eliminate the I/O cost, just concentrates it at the beginning and end.
 
@JerryCoffin I guess I'm massively under-estimating the cost of even doing that. Is there any math for calculating the cost based on number of bytes transferred?
 
@JABFreeware There is math, but it's somewhat non-trivial (depends on both the bandwidth and latency of the bus, and (for example) PCIe 3.0 increases bandwidth, but at the expense of also increasing latency. Testing is usually easier.
 
@JerryCoffin Well on NVIDIA systems you can execute and transfer data in parallel.
 
@Mikhail You can, and it helps, but it's not entirely trivial to do correctly either.
 
I did it correctly
 
3:31 AM
@JerryCoffin so basically you're saying test and see at what point it actually decreases total time to use the GPU and go through all the IO time, vs just having the CPU slowly chug along without the overhead?
 
@JABFreeware What hash are you dealing with here? A well-written hash on the CPU shouldn't be terribly slow (though you'll want to use at least SSE and preferably AVX instructions).
 
@JerryCoffin MD5 and Sha256
@JerryCoffin thanks for the info I appreciate it. I'll look up the SSE and AVX instructions you mentioned.
 
@JABFreeware I've never measured specifically for passwords, which pose their own set of problems. Good SHA-256 code running on longer messages can process around 180-200 MB/s, so it'll process fast enough to about saturate a decent SSD (assuming you're reading from/writing to the same physical disc).
 
@JerryCoffin Yeah unfortunately the CPU im testing on is AMD fx8350... not sure how good it is compared to intel for this. I think I read that in the real world AMD sucks at it. Good point though... since I need to output all the hashes and not a final result no point processing faster than the SSD
 
3:47 AM
the code I copy & pasted does not work
and it ruined a few other functionalities ...
 
@Telkitty hate when that happens
 
@JABFreeware The instructions you're looking for in particular (and offhand I don't remember whether an fx8350 implements them) are SHA256MSG1, SHA256MSG2 and SHA256RNDS2.
 
@JerryCoffin sweet! thanks man.
 
Implementing an auto completing text field, it used to auto complete for certain circumstance, now it doesn't do anything at all
 

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