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10:00 PM
@Walter Did I do what?
 
There are times when optimizing is good. Most of the time its not.
 
Besides, it's a very small part of libc that doesn't make it useful in general.
Burn libc.
 
@Insilico I can make my C++ standard library rely on zero C library functionality Insilico, 22:58
 
@sehe so I've put the requests through a proxy and the server receives 0x02 (STX) and then 1024 0x00... dumped the descriptors at each request on the before the send call and they all seem fine (tbh this is going through a crappy in-house library)
 
I don't really know what you're arguing for.
 
10:01 PM
so I'm thinking fuck it, and boost::asio, see if I can reproduce the problem
 
neither do I, lol
 
@Walter Yes. But the C++ library is not contingent on a C library. That was my point.
 
for the lulz
 
@Walter The implementation is irrelevant as long as it is up to specification.
 
Data explorer tells me stackoverflow.com/questions/6151571/… is the lowest-scoring non-deleted question.
 
10:02 PM
math.h is primitive and terrible at communicating errors, like almost all of libc.
 
@DeadMG agreed. that's the whole point of a (programming) language.
 
The 100,000 emails question is the lowest-scoring question of all time, it seems.
 
@Walter Not really. He may use a library that depends on some C, and probably depends on some assembly language as well. That doesn't mean he's using either one. There's also the fact that the C++ library he uses may or may not depend on the C library. Early C++ libraries were mostly thin wrappers around libc -- but that hasn't been the case for well over a decade now.
 
@netcoder use lsof, /proc/$PID/fd/, strace to find out more about filedescriptors (including sockets) being written to.
@netcoder You really seem to be up for a big fest if you need to fix this. Rewrite always seems attractive. Think your options over carefully, though
 
Well this question changed dramatically.
 
10:07 PM
okay gents. I'm going to approach a cushion with one side of my head for a while. I'll let you know which side works best in a few hours.
 
Xeo
So, in roughly 12 hours I'm going to negotiate the terms for my contract of employment... any advices?
 
@Xeo Look up what the market rate for your job is.
 
@Walter How about this: convince Linus Torvalds that since the Linux kernel is compiled with gcc, and gcc is now written in C++, that Linux is written in C++, and he's a C++ user. I dare you!
 
Xeo
@Insilico Ticked.
 
it's about time to write linux in C++ ...
 
10:09 PM
@Xeo Make sure it's the market rate around the area that you work.
(to account for cost-of-living differences, of course)
 
Xeo
Well, should have that.
 
@Xeo I could tell you what I earn, but not on here. That may give you some idea
 
Xeo
But I'll take any links to relevant sites where I could check that. :)
@TonyTheLion SO seriously needs some PM system
We could use Kerrek's secrect sexchange!
 
@Xeo indeed :)
 
@Xeo I assume you have researched the hell out of this company.
 
10:11 PM
@Xeo wut?
@Insilico I've never done that
 
Xeo
@TonyTheLion Nvm, it's a secrets exchange site he made
@Insilico Well...
 
I always just quickly browse their site before an interview
@Xeo lol
 
@Xeo You at least know who you're working for, right? :-P
 
Xeo
Sure
 
Hm. Anyone knows why ->* has such low precedence?
Other than "it's C++".
 
10:12 PM
@CatPlusPlus wouldn't that have been a C thing?
 
@MooingDuck No, it's actually not a C operator.
 
What, member pointers?
They're not very C.
Well, they're C in spirit.
 
@Xeo mumble /cc @TonyTheLion
 
@CatPlusPlus What precedence do you expect it to have?
 
@Walter Yeah. Good luck convincing Linus of that.
 
10:13 PM
I"ll do mumble @Xeo
 
I don't know, maybe the same one as ->.
 
Xeo
I'll need to load that
 
So you know you can do foo->*ptr()
 
@sehe thanks for the hint. rewritting is appealing, I was thinking to just test with a simple program with boost at first, and rewrite if it actually fixes the problem second :P
 
 
Xeo
10:15 PM
@CatPlusPlus Ask on SO and hope Howard answers
 
@sehe Completely unnecessary -- if you have a cat, of course it is.
 
Xeo
or that other committee guy on SO whose name I can't remember
 
@sehe: I know they are already
 
@Xeo Pete Becker? Doubt either has a lot to add about that -- they both spend most of their time on the library, not the core language (I haven't checked, but I doubt either is in the core language working group).
 
Xeo
10:16 PM
There's another one
 
@netcoder perhaps you can simplify first. If it is forking, use netcat + single process instead. If it reads from a pipe, simulate fixed input instead. If it does multiple connections, use a oneshot accept instead. Stuff like that. Reduce, minimize. Observe
 
Xeo
Something with D... I think
gaaah
 
@Xeo Plauger? Not sure if he's (still) on the committee though
 
0
Q: recusive function to find if a number is prime or not

Vitim.usI need to implement a recursive function that returns 1 if the number is prime or 0 otherwise. It's homework, but I missed a lot of classes because I was sick, and I can't find any didactic answer. I really appreciate a correct answer so than I can study.

 
@Xeo Dave Abrahams? Not sure if he was on here
 
10:17 PM
@Cat a question for you to answer ^
 
Newbie question: Is there a way to privately send a message through the system?
 
@Tony
@JonathanSeng No.
 
@JonathanSeng The system? Yeah, obviously
 
you can do std::array<T, N> x = { 1,2,3,4}, right?
 
Xeo
Dietmar Kühl it was.
 
10:18 PM
@DeadMG Yup. At least I think I used it
 
I would rather not make a public comment that someone should do something differently next time.
 
@DeadMG Assuming N is at least 4?
 
I'd really hate having to go through personal messages on SO
 
@JonathanSeng who should do what differently?
 
Ok, then public comment it is.
 
10:19 PM
you know, answer this guy's question, and then BAM! he's all over over sending PMs for every problem he has with his girlfriend and what not
 
@netcoder True that. Same with 'private' chat rooms. Don't start
^ Now that's smart marketing. Note R# 7 does VS2012 :)
 
hahah :)
 
6
Q: How to invoke pointer to member function when it's a class data member?

iammilindstruct B { void (B::*pf)(int, int); // data member B () : pf(&B::foo) {} void foo (int i, int j) { cout<<"foo(int, int)\n"; } // target method }; int main () { B obj; // how to call foo() using obj.pf ? } In above test code, pf is a data member of B. What's the grammar rul...

Ahahaha look at this code.
 
@sehe I've never seen Dave here at all. AFAIK, although Dietmar has attended committee meetings, he's never officially been a member. I believe Herb did post here once or twice, but that's about it. As long as I'm at that, James Kanze is in about the same position as Dietmar: has attended meetings, but isn't an official committee member.
 
I just changed the date on my computer. Can someone tell me when it is so I can put it back?
 
10:22 PM
@JerryCoffin Duly noted. Archiving for furuture reference
 
I wonder how much of my calendar I just screwed up
 
@MooingDuck It is now
 
@CatPlusPlus what's there to laugh?
 
@MooingDuck Today's October 2nd.
 
a.*b.c
 
That's funny:
@jons34yp Changed links in message. Next time, please suggest that site in favor of the other. — Jonathan Seng 7 mins ago
 
apt name for the way he asks questions
@CatPlusPlus oh yea that
 
@JonathanSeng That wasn't a secret ^ there. Also, 4 other comments already outed the answerer on the fact that cplusplus.com is substandard quality
 
ecx is x86 register and x86 only.
 
10:24 PM
@TonyTheLion it shows...
 
Each architecture calls them differently.
 
@sehe It was a matter of courtesy on how the person responded.
 
@Insilico I know its not October, or I'd have relatives calling wondering why I missed my own wedding :P
 
@CatPlusPlus I edited my answer
 
@JonathanSeng This site is community owned. You can feel free to improve his post. No need for him to consent, well, in theory :)
 
10:26 PM
\o/
 
@TonyTheLion I mean "now im just gonna repeat what i typed so that they will accept my question. :)" what the fuck man
 
@MooingDuck It's october 1913
 
@netcoder I know, terrible right.
 
Later guys. Errands to run.
 
later errand boy
:P
 
10:27 PM
@netcoder But: He's got a badge already: stackoverflow.com/badges/38/peer-pressure?userid=1646981 ! Achievement
 
Xeo
Mumble post-installation configuration is weird.
 
@JonathanSeng Why do you run errands, but walk dogs? Especially puppies generally want you to run, and nobody seems excited about errands.
 
@Xeo That'd be mumble client. And I agree. It's also not very useful IMO.
 
@JerryCoffin I think James Kanze was/is member of french (?) national committee
 
Xeo
Sooo.. server ip was?
 
10:29 PM
@JerryCoffin And wag tales, but tag whales?
@Xeo loungecpp.sehe.nl:64738
 
Dietmar was visiting here in the Lounge for a while, but I haven't seen him here lately
 
15k Rep :) Woo:)
 
@Cheersandhth.-Alf Not tooo long ago, really.
 
Well, he's the only one of those I've met IRL. He did a talk in Oslo for Oslo C++ User Group, and we all had some Indian hot food and lots of beer to wash it down. :-)
IIRC
 
@sehe too bad I (we?) can't see deleted questions, because it probably would have been a WTF too
 
10:31 PM
@Cheersandhth.-Alf Could be -- but I'm pretty sure that if so it was quite a while ago.
 
I'm thinking of starting a website: thedailysowtf.com
there's enough wtf material in a day to have fresh content for centuries
 
Just alias it to stackoverflow.com
 
@JerryCoffin well, he fixed the iostreams debacle (all examples in C++03 standard just included <iostream>, but the standard itself required also including <ostream> to get e.g. endl)
@TonyTheLion Cong Rats!
 
@Cheersandhth.-Alf IRL, I've met James, Dave, Howard, and a few others. Dave was probably the most surprising (at least to me) -- very tall (probably six and a half feet), very thin, and a former bicycle racer. During the first Boostcon, we did a ~40 mile bike ride together. Met Howard at Boostcon as well, but didn't get to talk with him much (he gave a talk about rvalue references, and was pretty much mobbed the entire time).
@Cheersandhth.-Alf Yeah, but I'm pretty sure that was just posting to comp.std.c++ (or possibly an email). Though none quite as visible, I've done some of the same sort of stuff (one post to c.s.c++, then some emails to Pete), and I'm quite sure I'm not on the committee! :-)
@TonyTheLion Congratulations!
 
hi!
My screen is completely gone blued out. I don't know what I pressed.
 
Ell
10:44 PM
Plug it in
 
@netcoder: stackoverflow.com/questions/12319460/… <-- my favorite wtf so far
 
Oh, yes, it was the cause! Thanks @Ell
 
@Takarakaka: we know you're trolling :P
 
Ell
Also silly a levels mean I can't be here so much :(
 
Am I so obvious? God, why me, why meeee?@netcoder [toBeHonestWithYou,IWasn'tTrolling](){}
 
10:46 PM
@Takarakaka: I remember you from the infamous "stealth mode from my teacher" stunt
 
I wasn't joking back then at all. I failed that part of the exam, and now I am here studying and whipping more and more stuff into my html head.:)
 
@Takarakaka: of course you weren't
 
So how are you today, my dear friend? @netcoder
Not a single one message to reply on my Hi! Why am I so blurred by the hegemony of the intrusive derived on-hook social paradigm?
 
Aug 29 at 22:28, by Takarakaka
@sbi I was trolling, didn't you figure it out so far. :D
@Takarakaka: tired, how about you? still working as director of net stuff at Cisco or something? :P
 
I trolled sbi, 'cause I deemed, and still deem he is smart enough to break my chain of back then messaged to him troll stacks.
 
10:53 PM
what's that thing in boost that makes it easy to initialize containers with << or something?
 
@MooingDuck Boost.Assignment (and FWIW, it uses +=, not <<, though the latter would probably work just as well).
 
I am so tired too, I worked all the day along. Yes, how did you know for what company I do? :) @netcoder
 
@JerryCoffin What was that about parking on a drive way?
 
@JonathanSeng You mean: "Why do we park on driveways and drive on parkways?"
 
/me walks back from his errand.
@JerryCoffin Exactly.
 
10:59 PM
I got so bored even in my troll mission on my troll account. I think it would be smarter for me to go and do some coding rather than chit-chatting here with AFK's. :P
 
@Takarakaka Trolling: The new national past-time. It even gets the benches cleared faster than baseball.
 
@JonathanSeng You made me laugh with that. Thank you. :P
See you all guys! :)
 
Wow.... "Writing good code instead of optimizing the code later"
 
why do windows users have to download the iTunes 10.7 update, when the only thing on the change list is "added support for iOS6"?
 
11:16 PM
Because iTunes sucks?
 
Because Apple.
 
@Insilico There is no "Because". It's just: Apple.
 
phone interview thing tomorrow
 
@DeadMG Good luck!
 
@DeadMG Best of luck.
 
11:18 PM
@DeadMG Have fun.
 
fucking government people want me to sign on in the morning
 
Wait, not that. The other thing.
 
@DeadMG The man...
 
1. Leave house at 10.20, spend 1h travelling to government place.
2. Spend 40 minutes there (2 minutes in government place, 38 because the trains are infrequent).
3. Spend about 1h travelling back.
4. Receive phone call about 30 minutes later.
 
@DeadMG Um.... that's risking missing the telephone call.
 
11:20 PM
@JonathanSeng Only if I miss a train.
more at risk of missing the govt thing
but it's just very tiring to be spending so many hours travelling to and from the government place
 
@DeadMG Things do happen.
 
@JonathanSeng They do. But if it does, I can call my father. He'd be irritated, but not deadly so, and it could be much worse.
and strictly, there's no reason why I can't take the call from inside the town with the government place in it.
 
@DeadMG Good backup plans.
 
the main thing I've found is that this thing is so up and down
either you're in a mad dash with minutes to spare, or you've got hours with nothing
it's difficult to relax and very stressful
 
@DeadMG Why do you describe 'the government place' and 'the city with the government place in it' in play-mobile language?
 
11:25 PM
@sehe so we don't konw where he lives
 
'government place' - ?
 
@sehe Because being more specific would entail handing out the name of the government place, and the town with the government place in it.
 
@sehe or he doesn't want us to know what kind of place.
 
hello, question about dealing with collisions
 
Oh really. I thought every city had a town hall, a civil administration, a central office, things like that
 
11:26 PM
Sep 9 at 11:45, by daknøk
If you are new here, please read the newbie hints right away, and only post here afterwards. Thank you.
 
@Portaljacker Wear belts
 
@sehe I don't live in a city.
 
@DeadMG Ok. That sucks
 
I used to live in a town, now I live in a village and I commute to a town for the government facilities there.
 
@MooingDuck People who work for "the government" are explicitly instructed not to divulge details that might put them in harms way. That's not a joke, either. It's very serious.
 
@JonathanSeng he's jobless, so that's not it
 
@MooingDuck "(I plan on deleting this)" - what a marvelous idea
 
Also, it's not UB if it's a compiler error (aka ill-formed).
 
@MooingDuck Oh, well, then he's just ashamed of where he lives.
 
11:29 PM
@JonathanSeng I think it's because he prizes his anonymity.
 
@JonathanSeng Or, like a sensible person, I don't want Anonymous coming and intervening in my actual life.
 
@MooingDuck Leave Neo alone!
 
@JonathanSeng What?
 
Maaaaatrix
 
yes, I know that
what I don't know is the connection
 
11:31 PM
@DeadMG maybe he's insinuating you're a super-hacker who lives anonymously on the internet like Thomas Anderson
 
@MooingDuck Right.
 
I've called myself many things, but a hacker isn't one of them
 
@JonathanSeng wait really? That was quite a stretch
what the heck? Wikipeida has a whole background on Neo based on a screenshot of the movie where his criminal record is plopped on a table.
Neo (real name Thomas A. Anderson, also known as The One, The Anomaly, and Mr. Anderson) is a fictional character and the protagonist of The Matrix franchise, as well as having a cameo in The Animatrix short film Kid's Story. He was portrayed by Keanu Reeves in The Matrix Trilogy and The Animatrix. Andrew Bowen provided Neo's voice in The Matrix: Path of Neo. In 2008, Neo was selected by Empire as the 16th Greatest Movie Character of All Time. Neo is also an anagram of One, a reference to his destiny of being The One who would bring peace. Character Background Thomas A. Anderson was bo...
 
@MooingDuck Well, it was either that or call him a worthless git. I'm a nice guy. Which one am I going to call him?
 
@JonathanSeng DeadMG is what I call him
 
11:36 PM
@MooingDuck We should call him puppy from the outskirts of the town with the government place in it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Outskirt Puppy?
 
@JonathanSeng Upskirt Puppy
 
I'mma knock off soon
btw robot, I wanted to ask you something
I actually ended up covering stuff like std::vector relatively late- after exceptions, exception safety, and stuff.
you think that's OK?
 
@DeadMG I know this wasn't directed at me.... But, are you asking about teaching or learning?
 
11:48 PM
teaching
 
I had that problem, too. There is a lot to using vectors, not the least of which is that it's a template. Using something before defining is a problem.
I found a point where it just made things so much easier, so I showed the students, "This is a magic vector. I promise we'll teach it later, but this will be the one time I will show you something and say 'do this' without fully teaching it." Later, I fully taught it.
I did, however, do a lot of, "Now, this assignment will be tedious and painful because we haven't taught you what will make it much easier yet."
 
@DeadMG I think collections are a simpler concept and are more "interesting" in terms of autonomous experimentation. And you need to bring in naked resources to provide motivation for exception safety. I really think vectors should come first.
 
yeah
 
But I haven't read all of it yet. When I do I can comment further if you want.
 
well, I did bring in std::string right away.
does that count? :P
 
11:53 PM
:)
 
Thats a well hidden template ;-)
 
I'll read it and see how it unfurls.
 
well, I must be sitting on a couple thousand extra words here, at least.
 
Personally, I really think providing opportunities for experimentation is crucial. But unfortunately, C++ makes that dangerous if not done right. That's the basis of my argument for "early vectors".
 
also, I randomly added a page on C-style I/O
@R.MartinhoFernandes The main reason I covered them late was because it simply didn't seem to flow.
I mean, most of the tutorials are the answer to a question raised in a previous tutorial
 
11:57 PM
@DeadMG Having a smooth sequence is also important, yeah. That's why I said I'll read them before more commenting.
 
indeed, you fairly did
I'm just too bone tired
and gotta get up way too early tomorrow :P
 
Go ahead. Sleep well, and good luck.
 

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